How Patrick Casey Turned Addiction into A Life of Purpose

Rich & Wendy 0:00
Hey, everyone is Rich Bennett. Can you believe it? The show is turning ten this year. I am so grateful for each and every one of you who've tuned in, shared an episode, or even joined the conversation over the years. You're the reason that this podcast has grown into what it is today. Together, we shared laughs, tears and moments that truly matter. So I want to thank you for being part of this journey. Let's make the next ten years even better. Coming to you from the Freedom Federal Credit Union Studios. Harford County Living presents conversations with Rich Bennett. 

Today, I'm going to get kind. 

No, no, no. The truth is. 

Rich Bennett 1:00
Today I am joined by my lovely co-host, Michelle Hayes. And we are thrilled to welcome Patrick Casey. Patrick has an incredible story of transformation, having been sober and in recovery since the age of 19, despite nearly two decades of sobriety. He continued battling inner struggles like self-hate, insecurities and constant worry. A breakthrough came when he attended a live event that led him to uncover the root of his self-destructive behaviors and redefine his beliefs. Now, Patrick is an advanced registered nurse practitioner and a personal coach helping men transform his self-destructive patterns into self-love, respect and joy. He's also a competitive boxer in the Masters division, showing that it's never too late to embrace physical and mental fitness. Patrick's mission is to create a safe space for men to be vulnerable and grow. And we're going to learn a lot. I have a funny feeling we're going to have some laughs, too, because there's a couple of things I really, really want to ask Patrick. And before we get to his story, I'm going to ask him right off the bat. You know, being a boxer. Be honest. What did you think about Paul and Tyson 

Patrick Casey 2:18
It's a waste of time. Total. 

Rich Bennett 2:19
again? 

Patrick Casey 2:19
Total money grab. Absolute money grab. I'm so glad I didn't have to pay extra for that. I was most I was mostly pissed. I had to stay up till like 1 a.m.. 

Rich Bennett 2:28
Oh, I know. Did he keep cutting that on you? 

Patrick Casey 2:31
It, did it. And then probably I think about the third round, it was fine. We got off and on and got off and on. It was really good. Was the female fight before the one before 

Rich Bennett 2:41
I wanted 

Patrick Casey 2:41
that 

Rich Bennett 2:41
to 

Patrick Casey 2:41
was. 

Rich Bennett 2:41
see that. And it kicked off, 

Patrick Casey 2:43
Yeah, we had to go back. We like kind of rewound it and then watched 

Rich Bennett 2:46
right. 

Patrick Casey 2:46
the rest of it after. That was a great, great fight. 

Rich Bennett 2:50
Oh, man. Yeah. I got so teed off. Watching that one is like, screw this, this shit sucks. I'm turning it off. And I, if I'm not mistaken, I think that was their first live event. 

Patrick Casey 3:01
It was a wall. I think the first live event was that which I did not watch was the Tom Brady roast. I think that might have been the first actual. 

Rich Bennett 3:09
Oh, that's right. 

Patrick Casey 3:10
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 3:11
I forgot about that. 

Patrick Casey 3:11
And then they just did the football game that was like flawless. 

Rich Bennett 3:15
Right and they just did. Monday Night Raw. 

Patrick Casey 3:18
Yeah. Which I didn't. 

Rich Bennett 3:19
Wrestling, which 

Patrick Casey 3:19
Either, 

Rich Bennett 3:19
was 

Patrick Casey 3:20
But 

Rich Bennett 3:20
live. 

Patrick Casey 3:20
I heard that was good. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 3:21
That was very good and no hiccups. 

Patrick Casey 3:23
Yep. 

Rich Bennett 3:23
So apparently they they got it. They got it right. 

Michelle Hayes 3:26
Text, whatever. Not fixed. 

Rich Bennett 3:29
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 3:29
Yeah. I mean. 

Rich Bennett 3:29
What? 

Patrick Casey 3:30
Crash. You crash the program when millions of people are trying to get on at the same time. 

Rich Bennett 3:35
Oh, yeah. Yeah. So I want to get into the story about addiction first, because usually you start at recovery at 19. So the scary question is when did addiction start? At what age? 

Patrick Casey 3:47
Yeah, right. It's obviously, it wasn't just like an overnight thing. I would say probably around ten, 10 to 11. 

Rich Bennett 3:53
All 

Patrick Casey 3:54
Probably started around there with, you know, I always tell people to, you know, for me, a fun Friday night was like going with the friends and like going around the shopping plazas and picking up little cigarette butts at the ashtrays 

Rich Bennett 4:04
right. 

Patrick Casey 4:05
or off the floor and smoking those, getting a little nicotine buzz. So that's like the first thing I remember as far as chasing that that feeling. 

Rich Bennett 4:12
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 4:12
That escape, that numbness. And then, you know, from there progressed to very young, probably 11, smoking marijuana. 

Rich Bennett 4:19
Right. 

Patrick Casey 4:19
This kid down the street. I grew up in Pembroke Pines, Florida. And this kid down the street, his older brothers were dealing weed. And so I forget his name, actually. He would sell us little nickel bags. And I'm like, What is this? Okay, yeah, let's do this. And we I mean, we were using like phony paper, Bible paper to roll this stuff up. We did know what we were doing and smoke smoking marijuana. I guess that was probably an omen, right? Using Bible paper. 

Smoked weed as a kid. So that kind of started started all of it. And then, you know, and my parents always had parties, probably most weekends. They had a lot of people over. We always played board games and, you know, the adults were drinking, carrying on, having fun. It was very attractive. So, you know, I'd walk around and drink the little bottles that were left laying around and probably, I don't know, 12, 13 years old, kind of drank a little bit more. But it really didn't take off until probably 14 or 15 years old. I was I was kind of a late comer. 

Rich Bennett 5:11
You got into high school. 

Patrick Casey 5:12
Yeah. Yes, sir. 

Rich Bennett 5:13
Yeah. 

Michelle Hayes 5:13
And were your parents aware of your drinking or was it completely under 

Patrick Casey 5:18
No. 

Michelle Hayes 5:18
the radar? 

Patrick Casey 5:19
Completely under the radar where we would grab stuff and run to the bathroom and, you know, finish drinking or just pick something up and, you know, chug a little bit and put it back down as everybody's carried on. And we even drinks laying around. And, you know, there were times they caught you know, I got caught with like marijuana at school. I got caught with whiskey at school. During high school. I had those like, you know, come to Jesus, talks with my dad, which obviously. Yeah, Dad, you don't know what you're talking about. Later to find out, my dad was into a bunch of stuff when he was younger too. But I didn't know you know, Of course he wasn't going to tell me. He was actually speaking 

Rich Bennett 5:50
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 5:50
from experience. Right. So, I don't know. I just kind of like I was just always chase and just chase and stuff. So trying to try to escape. 

Rich Bennett 5:58
I got to admit, I never heard of anybody rolling anything up in Bible paper, though. 

Patrick Casey 6:03
Yeah. You haven't lived. 

Michelle Hayes 6:04
It. 

Patrick Casey 6:05
You haven't. There you go. See? Michelle knows. 

Michelle Hayes 6:07
I've never done it. 

Rich Bennett 6:09
I have to share this story with you and you're going to laugh your ass off. So my brother used to get high all the time, and one day he wasn't home. So my parents were looking for his stash and they found it. So they got the bright idea. That's like, Hey, let's try it. Let's see what this is all about. Well, they were looking for papers in everything. They couldn't find anything. My parents found out the hard way. You cannot take marijuana and make a joint using toilet paper. 

Patrick Casey 6:39
Oh, my God. I. 

Rich Bennett 6:42
So they deny that they live anywhere. 

Patrick Casey 6:47
They got the smoke. I guess this. 

Rich Bennett 6:49
Oh, yeah. 

Patrick Casey 6:51
Anybody burning eyebrow or anything. 

Rich Bennett 6:54
I thought we were at home. It was like later when we fed that, When my father told us. My father, mother. 

Patrick Casey 7:00
That's good. That's good. 

Rich Bennett 7:02
You guys can't do that. How do you know? Terry told us. 

Yeah. We good? I usually I ever did it not as shot to nine. What actually inspired you to start your journey in recovery at 19. 

Patrick Casey 7:21
Well, it was about a year or so of putting needles in my arm and shooting up heroin. 

Rich Bennett 7:25
Oh, shit. You went that far. 

Patrick Casey 7:27
I did it. Yep, yep, yep. So. 

Rich Bennett 7:30
Damn. 

Patrick Casey 7:30
Yeah. So my parents were, you know, parents came home and found me after about a year or so. They came home while I was watching my sisters, my two younger sisters, while they were at their typical Friday night bowling league. And they came home and found me passed out on the couch needle, you know, built around my arm, stash everything laid out on the coffee table in the living room. And and I you know, I think I, I think looking back, Bob, I, you know, I, I kind of set it up to. 

Rich Bennett 7:57
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 7:58
To do that. You know what I mean? I kind of set it up kind of subconsciously. Like I've been wanting to get help for about six months. I didn't really know how to ask my. 

Rich Bennett 8:06
Mm hmm. 

Patrick Casey 8:08
And so I think I just kind of like it was completely uncharacteristic when I did that night to be doing something like that in the living room because I would always go in the bathroom, my bedroom, 

Rich Bennett 8:16
Right. 

Patrick Casey 8:16
other places and do it. And and I just was like, just I don't give a flip. I'm going to do it right out here in the open because my sisters are in bed and they came home and found me. So I woke up to my dad just shaking the heck out of me and my mom. 

Rich Bennett 8:29
Patrick. 

Patrick Casey 8:29
Freeman. 

Rich Bennett 8:30
Patrick. It's okay, man. You can swear. 

Patrick Casey 8:32
I can swear. Fuck. Yes. Okay. 

Rich Bennett 8:34
All right. All right. 

Patrick Casey 8:35
Yes. 

Michelle Hayes 8:35
Swear. Please. 

Patrick Casey 8:36
Okay. So I 

Rich Bennett 8:37
Right. 

Patrick Casey 8:37
never I usually ask ahead of time. So. So they're shaking the shit out of me and and. And I'm just like, man, what is it like this is happening right? Like this. This this is a bad dream. This is a terrible nightmare. They put me to bed. I wake up in the morning kind of thinking like, okay, did this really happen last night? That was a dream. I'm looking around for my stash, right? I can't find this shit anywhere. I'm like, Fuck this really happen. So I go downstairs. My mom's on the kitchen land line calling places. My son, My son. What do I do? What do I do? And so she found this place for me. And at this time, we're living in Augusta, Georgia. And I know you golf. So we're we're in Augusta, Georgia, right? Home of the Masters. I've been living there for about five years after we moved from Florida and so off to Atlanta, Georgia, I went to treatment and and I I can't describe to you the the immense relief and like. 

Rich Bennett 9:24
Yeah, 

Patrick Casey 9:25
Monkey off my back, that I felt that this finally happened, that like, I'm finally going to get help. I've been wanting to get help, like I said, for about six months. I'm thinking, do I tell him I'm addicted to pain pills? Do I tell him whatever The drinking's getting out of hand? Like like, 

Rich Bennett 9:39
right. 

Patrick Casey 9:39
what do I do? I need to get help. I don't want to tell him I'm shooting up heroin. Like, that's insane. So the whole thing just had to play out the way that it played out. 

Rich Bennett 9:48
Yeah. You know what, though? Somebody was looking over you because and correct me if I'm wrong, but because that was, what, over 20 years ago. 

Patrick Casey 9:56
This was 2000 to August of 2002. 

Rich Bennett 10:00
Okay, so this stuff wasn't laced with fentanyl. 

Patrick Casey 10:02
No, no, no. We. 

Rich Bennett 10:04
You're lucky. 

Patrick Casey 10:04
The good stuff we had, the good clean stuff. Overdoses were happening, but not as often. 

Rich Bennett 10:09
Right. 

Patrick Casey 10:10
You know, things were not as dire as they 

Rich Bennett 10:12
Crazy 

Patrick Casey 10:12
are. 

Rich Bennett 10:13
is 

Patrick Casey 10:13
Yeah. And I work in substance abuse, so I treat people, you know, as a nurse practitioner with with opiate addictions, and we give them Suboxone and, you know, methadone and all that stuff. So it's 

Rich Bennett 10:23
right. 

Patrick Casey 10:23
it's a lot different. 

Rich Bennett 10:25
So when once you started recovery while you were in recovery. Well, you're in. You're always in recovery. Let me rephrase that. 

Patrick Casey 10:34
Correct. 

Rich Bennett 10:35
So when you're at the recovery center, what were some of the biggest challenges that you were going through at the time? Because I know I mean, you hear the stories and a lot of people relapse. Some people will just say, no, this ain't for me. Get out of there because they need that fix. 

Patrick Casey 10:51
So I mean, I mean, for me, it was kind of again, I just I was ready. I was I wanted it so bad. So for me, it was it was it was just this like awakened in that. So I was I was willing to do whatever it took. And I barely slept for a month. Like, I like I told the people today that I treat them like you guys have it so good. The medications we gave you. There's a plethora we in there always change and stuff. They tried me on one medication. It made me feel like shit in the morning. I didn't sleep that night, so I barely slept for the first month that I was in treatment out of. 

Rich Bennett 11:21
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 11:22
Six days I was there. I would lay there and listen with my little CD player. I had the Red Hot Chili Peppers was a by the way, album. I forget which album was out. So I was I would listen. Listen, That Red Hot Chili Peppers, I think I had a couple of Pearl Jam albums I 

Rich Bennett 11:35
Okay. 

Patrick Casey 11:35
would listen to on this. I would just lay there and listen to those all night long, and then I'd walk around, talk with the staff, smoke cigarettes, and then just like, All right, time to get up. And my well, I'm already awake. So it was it was absolutely miserable. And they just they saw the need that like, well, you're coming off heroin. You're not that sick. So you don't need to do like, the whole detox thing. So they didn't put 

Rich Bennett 11:54
Right. 

Patrick Casey 11:54
me in a detox ward. I just kind of kicked it. You know, I had some Valium at home because there was this lady I worked with in the restaurant, and I would trade her weed for her prescription value. Right. 

Rich Bennett 12:05
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 12:05
Because I had been trying for like six months to get myself off of this shit over and over and over again. 

Rich Bennett 12:10
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 12:11
Hey, Donna, can I get your Valium again? You know, give you this quarter ounce or we will trade again. And so I was trying again. And so when my mom called that rehab and said, this is what's up with my son, they said, oh, he has value. Give that to him. The next couple of days, he'll know what to do that. So I use benzodiazepines to come off of heroin for a few days. So I'm still pretty sick, but not as sick as I would have been. 

Rich Bennett 12:33
Right? 

Patrick Casey 12:33
So. 

Rich Bennett 12:34
Yeah. And the thing is, a lot of people don't realize it. People that have never been in addiction, especially when it comes to heroin, you can't really just go cold turkey and quit. 

Patrick Casey 12:46
It's like having to tell people. It's like having a bad case of the flu, like the worst case of the flu you ever can imagine. You're not going to die from it, but you want to die. 

Rich Bennett 12:55
Right. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off. Go ahead, Pack. 

Patrick Casey 12:58
Good. I don't know if I answered your question. I was. I was going to say so. So, like, the challenges was. Pretty much not sleeping. It was 

Rich Bennett 13:07
Right? 

Patrick Casey 13:07
starting to have all the memories that, unbeknownst to me and subconsciously, I had been trying to run away from. Right. The 

Rich Bennett 13:13
Mm 

Patrick Casey 13:13
childhood 

Rich Bennett 13:13
hmm. 

Patrick Casey 13:14
stuff, the traumas, the insecurities, the low self-esteem, you know, all that stuff that I had been unknowingly trying to avoid. So here I am now. I'm about five days into rehab, and I'm starting to feel everything now. And, you know, as addicts, alcoholics, we don't want to feel because when we feel we want to run, we want to change 

Rich Bennett 13:34
Right. 

Patrick Casey 13:34
it. We want to numb it. We want to escape. So I'm like, I'm getting the fuck out of here. I'm leaving this place. I'm having those feelings. I don't want to do this stuff. And I was going to hop that wall and go do what I do. And a guy stopped me and said, What's going on? I said, This is what's going on. He said, You need to go to the group and share this. And I'm like, I'm not sharing this stuff. Are you out of your fucking mind? He's like, You need to go share it. And so I was at this crossroads where my friend says, Are you going to get to live in or are you going to get to die in? 

Rich Bennett 13:59
All 

Patrick Casey 14:01
I'm like, I'm choosing to live today. And I knew at 19 that this was a life or death situation for me, that it wasn't going to get any better on my own. So I went to the group. I said, I just vomited. Here's all my stuff. And I had that first experience with what it's like to unload my my garbage to another person, let alone a room full of people. And nobody ridiculed me, made fun of me, laughed at me, mocked me, made me feel any worse. They actually loved me, supported me, said, Oh, yeah, I went to that to oh, not only that, they were like one up in me, right? So I'm like, 

Rich Bennett 14:33
right. 

Patrick Casey 14:33
Oh, this is cool. Okay, so this is how this thing works. And so that was pivotal for me. And so I decided to stay and so I got through it. So that was like the biggest hurdle and challenge. And then after that, it was learning and seeing myself how I wear different mask, how I play the chameleon, how I can fall into hanging out with other people. And it was funny because at the end of my treatment, after 46 days, my therapist gave me like, like I did this evaluation thing for whatever reason, and she wrote on there, she wrote, Patrick is trying to make an A in treatment. 

You know, I mean, like, here I am trying to be like. Like the class pet. Like I'm. A recovery, Captain. Recovery. And I'm trying to be the poster child because just like with with sports and everything, you know, playing music, I would talk about anything I do. I want to be the absolute best at everything. I do. So I'm going to be the best damn little addict you ever saw, right? So it was just hilarious. And I came to realize, like, I need like, I got to find a way to be the authentic Patrick. How do I how do I learn how to be the. 

Rich Bennett 15:32
Your true self. 

Patrick Casey 15:33
Still learning that today. And that's why I got into the coaching, because I hit another bottom a couple years ago, which is like like I need to be me. I need to be me. I'm getting covered up by life and and still kind of doing that same stuff that I have unresolved things that I didn't even know were still there. 20 years into sobriety. 

Rich Bennett 15:51
So what? Because another question I was going to ask you was, is what's been the biggest challenge, you know, during your recovery? But apparently there's something you said you hit a hurdle. What was that hurdle? 

Patrick Casey 16:03
Yeah. So it's like you read it, you read the introduction. In the beginning was my girl, my fiance, a girlfriend. Then a couple of years 

Rich Bennett 16:11
Right. 

Patrick Casey 16:11
ago. Was I follow in a podcast or she's a coach and like yourself which congratulations on ten years She's. 

Rich Bennett 16:18
Oh, thank you. 

Patrick Casey 16:18
Yeah, I heard you heard about that on your last episode. She's been doing this for about ten years or so, too. Well, she was holding the live event in Southern California. My girlfriend's like, Hey, I'm going to this event. You know, kind of introverted and a little shy, you know? Would you come with me? And like, Sure. Like, I'm open minded. I'm sober a while. I know. Probably I'll get something good out of it. And I got way more out of it than she did. And I had this breakthrough that, like, I still don't love myself, I still hate myself, I still talk really shitty to myself. I don't know how to take compliments from people 

Rich Bennett 16:48
Why? 

Patrick Casey 16:48
like like this makes no sense. Here I am in South Florida, living close to the beach. Nice house car, good income career. Do I get boxing, soccer, tennis, pickleball. Like I'm doing all the activity sports. I'm healthy. Like I don't drink. I don't smoke. Could I not love myself? And it was 

Rich Bennett 17:08
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 17:08
like. You haven't really fixed those things or you haven't really touched on those things that you couldn't do with therapy or you couldn't do with taking antidepressants in your early twenties. So like, I had some unresolved stuff. I wasn't aware. I was still like, you know, flippin off. You know, if, if, if something sent me off, I was just flipping over, you know, like a pot of boiling water. Any little thing was like this explosion, right? 

Rich Bennett 17:34
Right. 

Patrick Casey 17:35
Why does this happen? I'm like, Oh, maybe I'm not spiritual enough, or maybe I'm not doing enough sober stuff. It's like, Well, no, I'm still doing the same thing. I'm just not using drugs and alcohol. I'm using all these accomplishments and achievements and hobbies to not not look at myself and not really focus on the guy that I see in the mirror and like. So I made it in this group of people that I want to look at myself, the way that Caitlin looks at me. I want to love myself the way that she loved me, the way that other people love me. And I know I can't love you until I love myself that way. So 

Rich Bennett 18:05
Right. 

Patrick Casey 18:05
how do how do I do that in this lady? Jill listens. The. The. 

Rich Bennett 18:09
Oh. 

Patrick Casey 18:10
You know JJ? 

Rich Bennett 18:11
Yes. 

Patrick Casey 18:13
Favorite person. So I've been working with. I've been working with her the last two years. So she came up to me and she's like, you know, this doesn't have to end like this. It's like, we can I can help you. And even if it's not me, let somebody help you. Like you can't have this breakthrough and then go back home to Florida and go about your business. And just like. Just like when my parents found me and I went off to rehab and that five days after I was at this crossroads and I was like, I don't know what this means. I don't know how you're going to help me on the other side of the country, but let's do it. I don't care what it cost, what it means. Let's go. Let's do it. And 

Rich Bennett 18:47
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 18:47
and it's just it's it's completely broken me open over the last two years. And to where then? I just did, like, a business course with her. I did the emotional stuff first, and then I did a group business course with her, which you're nodding your head, You understand? 

Rich Bennett 18:58
He's awesome. 

Patrick Casey 18:58
Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 18:58
She 

Patrick Casey 18:59
right, 

Rich Bennett 18:59
is awesome. 

Patrick Casey 18:59
Right. 

Rich Bennett 18:59
Yeah, 

Patrick Casey 18:59
So. So then I got into coaching thinking I'm like, Why can't I help other guys who suffer with this stuff, too? Because I've been always helping people with substance abuse and recovery. What about the everyday guy that doesn't have those addiction problems, 

Rich Bennett 19:11
right. 

Patrick Casey 19:11
that also struggles like we do? 

Rich Bennett 19:14
Wow. Holy. That's. That's weird. I didn't realize it was J.J. 

that. Well, I guess more or less helped you to discover that. 

Patrick Casey 19:25
Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 19:27
And all thanks to your girlfriend. 

Patrick Casey 19:29
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 19:29
Now, now, fiancee or now? Are you guys married now? 

Patrick Casey 19:31
Fiancee, which is why I was trying to get you to come. DJR our reception. 

Rich Bennett 19:38
Down in Florida. 

Patrick Casey 19:38
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 19:38
How? 

Patrick Casey 19:39
Yeah. Got. 

Rich Bennett 19:41
You know what I have? I know a really good guy. I. 

Patrick Casey 19:47
Right. 

Rich Bennett 19:48
You know? No, you know, I do miss it at times, but I really stopped doing it because my son couldn't commit to it anymore. And I it's hard for me to carry that equipment all the time in 

Patrick Casey 20:01
I'll carry it for 

Rich Bennett 20:02
a 

Patrick Casey 20:02
you. got you. 

Rich Bennett 20:03
year. But you you ain't going to come up here and load it up. 

Patrick Casey 20:06
Where are you, by the way? I forgot. 

Rich Bennett 20:08
I'm in Maryland. 

Patrick Casey 20:09
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 20:09
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 20:09
Okay. I have a friend. 

Michelle Hayes 20:11
And 

Rich Bennett 20:11
Little. 

Michelle Hayes 20:11
to. 

Patrick Casey 20:12
With the house up there, So. 

Rich Bennett 20:13
What's that? 

Patrick Casey 20:14
friend with a house up there. Maybe. Maybe we can work it out. 

Rich Bennett 20:17
Oh, really? Whereabouts do you know? 

Patrick Casey 20:19
Ocean side or something. 

Rich Bennett 20:21
Ocean City. 

Patrick Casey 20:22
Yeah, I think it. 

Rich Bennett 20:23
Yeah. Right on the ocean. On the ocean, of course. That's why it's called. It's. 

Patrick Casey 20:27
I think. 

Michelle Hayes 20:28
I thought it was next to a lake. 

Patrick Casey 20:30
Lake City. 

Rich Bennett 20:31
God, 

Michelle, you know, I she. 

Michelle Hayes 20:36
I'm 20 minutes away from reach in my office. 

Patrick Casey 20:38
Yeah. Okay, so you're close. 

Rich Bennett 20:41
Yeah. Thank God she's 20 minutes and not right next to me. I'm joking. 

Michelle Hayes 20:45
This morning. I was. Mexico's great. 

Rich Bennett 20:50
God said we. So we. 

Michelle Hayes 20:53
Share, Rich. 

Rich Bennett 20:54
So we know it was J.J. that that helped you, especially with the coaching and everything. When did you actually start coaching yourself? 

Patrick Casey 21:02
Oh, probably few months ago. So. 

Rich Bennett 21:05
Okay? 

Patrick Casey 21:06
She got me to do, you know, which again, is a lot of my entire story the last 20 plus years is doing hard things, doing things that my brain says, Well, what are people going to think and why are you doing that? And you shouldn't be doing that. So she got me to do, you know, a webinar. And then I did another masterclass and then I started coaching and, you know, I'm looking into, you know, taking workshops into some of the rehab places because there's so many down here just. 

Rich Bennett 21:32
Mm hmm. 

Patrick Casey 21:33
Working it, you know, just kind of trying to share some of this material with people and seeing if anybody's interested, if they're going to, you know, you know, latch onto that kind of stuff. Because, again, I see it from the side because I'm the one treating people in the inpatient settings. So I'm treating people with medications, you know, checking their lab work and etc.. And I'm seeing what you were talking about, which is the relapse. Oh, you're back 

Rich Bennett 21:54
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 21:54
again. Oh, you're back again. Oh, hey, good to see you back again. Oh, so-and-so died. So-and-so passed away. You hear about so-and-so, It's like over and over and over again. It's like, what's missing? What's missing? It's like for some people, the medications aren't the answer. For some people, 

Rich Bennett 22:08
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 22:08
it's like me. It's let's get to the core root of stuff. Sometimes medications are necessary, and you and I treat a lot of veterans like yourself where it's like, you know, 

Rich Bennett 22:16
hmm. 

Patrick Casey 22:16
a lot of first responders, veterans and the. 

Rich Bennett 22:18
Thank you for that. 

Patrick Casey 22:19
Of course, man. And, 

Rich Bennett 22:20
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 22:21
you know, and funny enough, both my sisters ended up marrying a marine. 

Rich Bennett 22:24
Right. 

Patrick Casey 22:25
So. 

Rich Bennett 22:26
Smart women. 

Patrick Casey 22:27
It's in my family now. So it's it's so big, man. And I hear all the stories and and the traumas and it's like, need to get down and dirty to that fix. Fixing that. 

Rich Bennett 22:38
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 22:39
And that's what JJ did for me was let's let's find these core wounds and tap into those to figure out what they are. But more than just having the self-knowledge about them, what are we going to do about it? And that was the next phase that she took me to as well, which was the work that was involved with with overcoming those, working through those. So it's been huge, man. I just had this really big dialogue thing I did with my mom back in around Halloween. I drove up to Georgia to visit my family and this was like a way overdue conversation I had with her that JJ coached me through about a year ago that I just didn't get around to having the chance to do it. And my mom and I had this huge breakthrough made with with a lot of my childhood stuff. It it was it was. 

Rich Bennett 23:19
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 23:20
So impactful and so over overdue that that's the kind of stuff that people need to do, that they may or may not even have the chance to do those things. 

Rich Bennett 23:31
But there had to be tears there between you and your mom. 

Patrick Casey 23:34
So many over overdone tears. And she's like, she's like, Oh, this is great. I want to do this with this person and this person. And, 

Rich Bennett 23:40
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 23:40
you know, she 

Rich Bennett 23:41
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 23:41
even said, like, I wish I could have done this with my dad, my grandfather, who was a World War two Navy Navy veteran, passed away at 94, about three 

Rich Bennett 23:48
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 23:48
about three years ago. So 

Rich Bennett 23:51
Why? 

Patrick Casey 23:51
yeah he's one of the few that are still were was one of the few that were still. 

Rich Bennett 23:54
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 23:55
And she's like, I wish I could have done it with him because, hey, guess what? She had her own childhood trauma. And guess what? That shit gets passed down. So here I am. And so the last thing I want to do is carry that forward. I want to stop that. 

Rich Bennett 24:08
You know what? And the thing is, with 

especially a lot of the World War two vets, the Vietnam vets, and even the Korean War vets, a lot of those guys don't open up. And even even current veterans, it seems like a lot of veterans and first responders. And correct me if I'm wrong, it is because because you help them. But if they've been through the through anything, it's it's very, very hard to open up. And I did find that especially veterans, veterans, it seems like it's easier for them to talk to other veterans. 

Patrick Casey 24:42
100%. 100 per. 

Rich Bennett 24:43
But outside of that, it's still. And even other veterans. Talking to other veterans, sometimes it's hard, you know. But oh, thank you for that, because that is something that's definitely needed. And I'm glad that you're doing it with first responders, too, because I'm going to miss. First responders, whether it be EMTs, firefighters, police. Do not get the credit and respect they deserve because. Yes. If you're in the military, you may see war time. You may go through a lot of shit. But these guys here, the first responders, they're at war every freakin day, whether you know it or not. 

Patrick Casey 25:24
Yeah. And you get done and then you've got to move on to the next case. You don't even get time 

Rich Bennett 25:28
Yes. 

Patrick Casey 25:28
to process. What the hell was that? 

Rich Bennett 25:30
Yeah. And it ain't like. Here's the thing. And God, back in the day, 

especially the police, you know, they were told after you get off work, go out and drink. You know, what's that solve? It doesn't solve anything. You know, it's basically you're putting a Band-Aid on the wound. That's all you're doing. 

Patrick Casey 25:53
Sometimes. And so that's the thing for me is, like you said, a lot of them are untrusted and guarded, heavily walled up. So I have to try to find common ground, you know? So I try to find I work as a nurse for about eight years before I went back and got my nurse practitioner in 2018. So I worked in trauma, I worked in Atlanta, Georgia. So like I did that side after the EMTs, firefighters would bring the patients to us, then we got them. So I had a little taste of it, but same thing. We would work a case. They didn't make it onto the next one. This child just drowned and we couldn't get him back. Or this kid shot himself or hung himself or there's bad car accidents like, oh, onto the next thing. But at least at that point they were helpful with like. Let's process this. Let's grieve this. Like. Like, do you need to talk about this after your shift? But there was no talking about in process. And during your shift, you had to keep doing your 12 hours, just like you said, like he's first responders have to go on to the next one. And that's what they all talk about and they get so burned out. 

Rich Bennett 26:51
When it comes to men because you help a lot of men. And this is something I although I I see it now in the younger generation, when I see a younger generation, I'm going to say probably mid twenties twenties on down now. With the self love. They don't love themselves. Why do you suppose that they don't even respect them? Well, I don't think you can respect yourself until you love yourself in the first place. But why do you think that is? 

Patrick Casey 27:19
I don't know if I. You're saying the younger generation. 

Rich Bennett 27:23
I mean, you see a lot of people, a lot of men. 

Michelle Hayes 27:27
I do see it here. I have a brother, Mitchell and I, my husband actually both have brothers that are 21 and they're very polar opposite 111 very much accepts himself and one seems to be very self-deprecating. And we love them both. We adore them both. But the one it seems to be he doesn't know how I will say, you know, dad died. 

Rich Bennett 27:56
How to love himself. 

Michelle Hayes 27:57
12 years ago. So he's always searching for that male role model. And we've done what, you know, we've done as best we can to raise him properly. But I think Rich, the answer to your question honestly, you know, from the from the mom point of view, I also have a 13 year old son at home 

is they don't know how they're not loved and respected elsewhere and they're not seeing their fathers love and respect themselves. And then it's just kind of, you know, like you said, you know, the I think Patrick said it earlier, basically it rolls downhill. And so then the child is going, well, what am I doing wrong? Where am I doing the bad thing? And they hate on themselves so much. And I even see it with my son. And he'll go, you know, I'm so sorry. I'm such an idiot. No, you're not an idiot. You did something idiotic and we're going to laugh about it, but you're not an idiot. And, you know, even at 13, you see that. And it's not discouraged in society at all. 

Patrick Casey 29:05
And it's like, where did he learn that from? Like, you're obviously not telling him he's an idiot. So is it is it like the ladies on the from the actually place you had the episode released the other day is it is it the cell phones? Is it the social media at the young age that they're learning and they're getting the dopamine hits and oh, I they got 35 likes instead of 1600 like the other person. Is there some of that reflection on like self-worth stuff? Because I think there's a lot of that, too. 

Rich Bennett 29:30
Yeah, that would make sense now that you say that because, I mean, yeah, a lot of a lot of the kids in younger well, just look at all these what do you call the social media influencers. How many of them end up taking their lives early? 

Patrick Casey 29:46
Well. 

Rich Bennett 29:46
Because of that, although I did get as many likes or whatever. Yeah, it's sad, but but with the self-love part, I guess my biggest thing is how do you teach that to men? You to love themselves? 

Patrick Casey 30:01
For me, it was it was seeing what my core wounds were. And for me, it was feeling rejected. Disapproved of defective. So for whatever reasons, through my childhood, those were things I struggled with. Looking back now. So any time today, one of those come up like your son, Michelle. I do some stupid. I'm like, you dumb son of a bitch. Like you knew better than that. You're such an idiot. So I have the responses, right, like I get. But if you trigger me, I get defensive. I would. You know, I withdrawal. I when people. Please. I want to argue like I have all the the whole synapse effect happens when my core wounds are triggered. And so for me, it was again, doing things that don't really make sense, like why? What does this have to do with this? But it's like doing hard things. So maybe I stand in front of the mirror and recite mantras to myself. Maybe I call several people a day and I do this what we call rampage of appreciation, where I go through all these things that I appreciate because it's about turning the negativity. My default is being negative, negative, negative, and it's about turning around positive. Well, guess what? I have all four extremities. I have a driver's license, I have a job. Am I? Do I get stressed and get upset? Yes, with my job. But guess what? I have a job and it pays well. I can drive from A to B because I have a driver's license. I have a vehicle with four tires that work. So it's like, turn it around. What do I appreciate without the story? Because I always I always have a story for everything. And it's I think a lot of it is is is addiction to control. I want to control everything. I want to control you. You know, the way this podcast goes, I want to control the way my workday goes. I want to control the way, way my fiance behaves. I want to control everything because then I can feel safe and secure. And that was the ultimate overall arching theme of my childhood rich and Michelle is that I didn't feel safe, I didn't feel secure. I always had a confused childhood and my parents did the best they could. Unfortunately, it wasn't good enough. I had to kind of like take over and start self-soothe in myself and in different ways, you know? 

Rich Bennett 32:09
For those of you listening, Patrick and I are here for that, Michelle, because apparently she's got one of those clappers or a motion like. 

Michelle Hayes 32:17
It's a motion activated light in my office. 

Rich Bennett 32:20
It went out as she was in the dark and she's waving her arms. If you were to clap and that light came on that we would have lost. 

Patrick Casey 32:29
It would have been awesome. 

Rich Bennett 32:31
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 32:32
Yeah. So it's just about like figuring out, like, how can I be safe and secure? And for me, it was, it was I, you know, compliments. I didn't know how to take compliments or just like when people compliment you, say thank you. Don't say 

Rich Bennett 32:45
Yeah, 

Patrick Casey 32:45
things, but you know that it. But you know, this old shirt, whatever, you know, say thank you and move on or say thank you. I appreciate 

Rich Bennett 32:53
right. 

Patrick Casey 32:53
that. So I sort of doing those things. And so the more I started doing these positive, energetic vibrational things going in this other direction, duh, I started thinking better about Patrick. I started looking at Patrick differently. And so that's just a natural thing that happened. So that's where the self-love comes. The self love comes from showing myself I love myself because of the way that I take care of myself. I'm not stopping at McDonald's. I'm not giving in to grabbing that that ice cream sundae. I mean, it's fine to have I can do that. But like, am I doing it because I had a stressful day? Am I doing it because somebody's pissed me off? Am I doing it because I didn't get that paycheck yet? So like, what are the reasons and my motivations? I do like silly stuff. Like, you love this. I had the superhero kid actually sitting here by the door, the superhero cape that J.J. said, You know, when you're driving to work put they keep on once in a while because you're driving to work cause you're a hero. Like. Like, feel that. Like, put on some. 

Rich Bennett 33:47
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 33:47
Do. Like. Like. Act it out. I mean, because you're doing heroic things, you're helping save lives every day. But to me, it's just it's just a 9 to 5 job. It's what I do. I forget people's lives are on the line every friggin day. So what am I going to do about it? Like and just kind of like aimlessly go through my day and do that automatic pilot while I'm driver, am I going to, like, kind of focus on some good positive things or call some people or listen to a good positive podcast or a, you know, a YouTube video or something like that. 

Rich Bennett 34:17
You're listening in on the conversations with Rich Bennett. We'll be right back. 

Take a little break here. I want to talk about one of my sponsors, Marilyn Picker's. Marilyn Pickers is a local junk removal service, and they also have dumpster rentals as well. I actually called Jeremy when we were doing our spring cleaning this year, and he brought the dumpster out and quick to answer to. Third came out the day he said he was going to pick it up, answered all my questions. Everything was fine. Phenomenal. Very professional to work. So if you're looking for junk removal service, if you're looking to rent a dumpster, contact Marilyn Picker skirted Marilyn pickers dot com or give them a call at 

4432061859. Again it's 

4432061859. Tell them that. Rich from Harvard. Kennedy Levinson. 

Michelle Hayes 35:14
I think it's important to note that you say these things, but it's also important that they're hard. I know my generation. It's hard to say, you know, someone compliment you. Oh, I love your hair. Thank you. 

But it took me an hour to crawl this morning because I really didn't feel like washing it. It's so easy and ingrained in us to just kind of give an excuse on why it's not okay and why they shouldn't have complimented you and Oak Ridge. We know you didn't. 

Rich Bennett 35:46
No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm not. I'm not pulling on my head because I'm bald. I'm saying. And Patrick may grieve this or may not. It's because you have more negative thoughts in your head than the positive thoughts. Negativity will draw negativity really quick. And it's a. Patrick, correct me if I'm wrong. It's an I want to say it's an art or science or whatever to try to have that positive mindset all the time. But when you learn how to do it, oh my God, the positivity that you attract is amazing. And it just it, it makes your it just makes your life so much easier. It took me a while to learn. That's one of the reasons I don't want you to lose. 

Patrick Casey 36:33
Yeah. 

Michelle Hayes 36:33
Do you look in the mirror and say positive things to yourself? 

Rich Bennett 36:36
I do. I tell myself. In all honesty, I do. I tell myself every day that I love myself. Every morning when I wake up, the first thing I do, I have a little angel that our daughter that we lost. I was able to put it in her hand. I'll hold that angel. Grab my Bible. I'll say a prayer. I have a little rock that my other daughter found when she was a little kid. I call it my Grateful Rock. So I'll say something that I'm grateful for every day, and then I get up. Yes, I'll look in the mirror and it's funny because there's times you always get ready for work and I'll just stand next to her. I'll say, God, we really are a lovely looking couple, aren't we? She's like, Shut 

Patrick Casey 37:17
See. 

Rich Bennett 37:17
up. 

But 

Michelle Hayes 37:21
See, I started 

Rich Bennett 37:22
no, 

Michelle Hayes 37:22
with. 

Rich Bennett 37:22
I do. I do it all the time. You 

Michelle Hayes 37:25
I 

Rich Bennett 37:25
have 

Michelle Hayes 37:25
started 

Rich Bennett 37:25
to. 

Michelle Hayes 37:25
with one of the apps and they they have you starting with it's one of the mental health apps because I can't look in the mirror and talk to myself. I think it's weird and it just I can't break that. And so it has. You start with look in the mirror and say, I can do this every morning. And it's not that I hate my job. I love my job. I own my own business. It's great. I get to work with Rich. 

Make fun of it, 

Rich Bennett 37:51
You know what? You know, honesty, Michelle. The 

Michelle Hayes 37:53
it's. 

Rich Bennett 37:53
mirror part. It takes practice. It takes practice. And you'll be able to do it. 

Patrick Casey 37:57
It's uncomfortable. I could. 

Michelle Hayes 37:58
It is. 

Rich Bennett 37:59
At first. At first it is. 

Patrick Casey 38:01
It feels. 

Rich Bennett 38:01
But. 

Michelle Hayes 38:02
Shouldn't be. 

Patrick Casey 38:02
Fake. It feels inauthentic. 

Rich Bennett 38:04
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 38:04
It feels robotic, but it's. It's kind of like I can't wake up in the morning. Go. I'm going to be positive today. Today's going to be a positive. Day like that doesn't work. I have to, like, do some thing that's positive. Do positive. 

Rich Bennett 38:17
Yes, 

Patrick Casey 38:17
Do an appreciation list. Sometimes I write down goals like some of them are things that are actually coming up, like, I'm looking forward to this vacation. I'm looking forward to this trip. I'm going on this show that we're going to go see. I'm looking forward to having $1,000,000. I'm looking forward to going to Italy. But I don't have that plan that might be ten years from now. 

Rich Bennett 38:37
right. 

Patrick Casey 38:38
So I do things that are like upcoming and the things that I want to happen. So it changes that, that, that into something positive. It's kind of like you said, Michelle and I think Rich, you were saying, too. It's more so about when somebody compliments me. It's the story I see myself to myself. Like like these things sound different. I want to have a lot of money because then I don't have to worry about bills every day that I. I don't have to worry about having to fix my car all the time and then I can get out from under this house. That sounds different. Then I want to have a bunch of money because I want to have the independent and freedom to travel to come and go to help my family. Like, those are two different things. But the goal is the same is to have a lot of money. So it's the story I tells. It's the way that I see it. Because once I start going, you know, it's like when somebody tells you something, you say, Yeah, but everything after that but negates everything, right? Like you were saying, if I 

Michelle Hayes 39:27
Right? 

Patrick Casey 39:27
get a compliment. 

Michelle Hayes 39:28
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 39:28
So just like when I tell myself I want this or that, but a lot, I completely change the vibration. I completely change the energy underneath it. 

Rich Bennett 39:38
You know, the funny thing is, too, and I'm a stickler on that when somebody says thank you, yeah, definitely say you're welcome. But when it comes comes to social media and the text and everything, you can only say you're welcome. 

You know, Ed, you thank God for Moody's because to me, that's I just it's in person. When you say it, when you hear it, it makes such a big, big difference. A huge difference. One of the things and oh God, I can't remember who I was talking to, but we were talking about mentorship, which I believe everybody should have a mentor and we were talking about it on one of my episodes and I mentioned that I have mentors and they don't even know that they're my. Mentors. 

Patrick Casey 40:30
Nice. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 40:31
And the person said, Well, you should tell them. like, I never thought about that. 

Michelle Hayes 40:37
I was going to say my mentor was the best one in the whole world. 

Rich Bennett 40:42
Huh? 

Michelle Hayes 40:43
said, I just want to say my mentor is the best one in the whole world. 

Rich Bennett 40:48
Who's that? Mitchell. 

Michelle Hayes 40:49
If you. 

Patrick Casey 40:50
think it's the guy on the 

Rich Bennett 40:51
Ow, 

Patrick Casey 40:51
screen. 

Rich Bennett 40:51
ow, ow, ow. I thought I figured you'd be eventually. 

Patrick Casey 40:57
She's very humble, very humble. 

Rich Bennett 41:00
Well, thank you, Michelle. 

Michelle Hayes 41:01
I 

Rich Bennett 41:02
No, 

Michelle Hayes 41:02
not. 

Rich Bennett 41:02
but. 

Michelle Hayes 41:02
Santa Claus. 

Rich Bennett 41:06
It's funny because the thing is, a lot of times you may you may have a mentor not even realize that your mentor. You know it, but it's Anyways, we're getting off topic here. But one of the things I do want to ask you about 

and I really love this, but the boxing. How has that? When did you start doing it? How has that played a role in your personal growth and recovery? 

Patrick Casey 41:33
I started around COVID like my it's still still still getting used to seeing my fiancee. My fiancee, we just got engaged December 23rd. So it's still new 

Rich Bennett 41:45
Oh, my 

Patrick Casey 41:45
things 

Rich Bennett 41:45
God. 

Patrick Casey 41:45
got. 

Rich Bennett 41:45
Congratulations. 

Patrick Casey 41:46
Appreciate 

Rich Bennett 41:46
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 41:46
it. Appreciate it. So she'd been boxing a little bit longer and. 

Rich Bennett 41:51
Oh. 

Patrick Casey 41:51
Yeah. Yeah. Shoe boxes, too. Yep. Yep. 

Rich Bennett 41:54
So she threatened you? 

Patrick Casey 41:57
You see this black eye that's, you know. She 

Rich Bennett 41:59
Right. 

Patrick Casey 42:00
she'd been doing it. And her trainer, you know, with COVID, it was kind of like, you know, all the gyms are closed. And he said, well, we can go to this park and we can do some stuff outdoor. I can hold the mitts and bags. And I was like, okay, cool. So I go out there and I'm you know, I'm stiff as a board and I don't know what I'm doing. And it's funny, I have a whole video montage thing I put together from the progression over the last four years. It's hilarious, but it's cool to see the progression because of the work that I put in now. I had no intention on ever, ever competing. So I started at 37. I'll be 42 in a couple of weeks actually. So I start at 37. 

Rich Bennett 42:32
Happy early birthday. 

Patrick Casey 42:33
Thank you, guys. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. So I started, like, you know, just doing it just to kind of get in shape and to lose a little bit of weight. You know, like I said, I've always played basketball, soccer, sports. I've always been active. So. 

It was probably two years ago. He's like, Hey, let's start sparring. Let's start going to some other gyms and spar. And I'm like, What? So we started doing that, going to other places and sparring against other guys who were trying to take my head off. Right 

Rich Bennett 42:59
Oh, wow. 

Patrick Casey 43:00
now, again, we're where we're wearing headgear and, you know, 16 ounce gloves. So it's it's safer. But you still get raw. And I still got kind 

Rich Bennett 43:07
Right. 

Patrick Casey 43:07
of flashed a couple of times and still get knocked out if you're not careful. And then we had the Golden Gloves event coming up in 2022, three, 20, 23, right? Yeah, 2023. So I competed in that. So I won that for £165 for again, Masters Division 40 and over 

Rich Bennett 43:25
A. 

Patrick Casey 43:26
and do. That was the scariest thing I've ever done in my life. I felt like scary. I've jumped out of plane a couple of times and, you know, it's the scariest thing I've ever done. It's still today every time I have a match, sometimes even sparring, somebody I haven't sparred against. Those butterflies, those nerves, 

Rich Bennett 43:40
Uh 

Patrick Casey 43:41
the 

Rich Bennett 43:41
huh. 

Patrick Casey 43:41
self-doubt starts kicking in, but it's not as debilitating as it was the first couple of times. And so I was working with JJ during this time and her group, and so they all kind of helped me get through that. And I got through it again, won the match. I got the Golden Gloves belt and then 2020 edition of 23, I fought again and won. And then in 2024 last year, I did the Golden Gloves again and won again. 

Rich Bennett 44:03
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 44:04
And then we went to Atlantic City for our first traveling tournament. So we went to Atlantic City. The box back in September, this past September, and I moved up a weight class, which probably wasn't the best idea because there was less fighters there. And I lost a very close match, but I lost. So I have a three in one record. But it was fine. And like you would think, Why are you doing this? You have a career, you're professional, and what the hell is wrong with you? 

Rich Bennett 44:32
You know what, Patrick? You didn't lose. 

Patrick Casey 44:34
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 44:35
You said something. You said 

Patrick Casey 44:36
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 44:36
sort of right there. So yeah, you're doing it. You more or less stepped out of your comfort zone. You're doing something you thought you would never do, you know? So you're. You definitely one man without 

Patrick Casey 44:49
And 

Rich Bennett 44:49
a. 

Patrick Casey 44:49
everybody says that, too, You know, like just just stepping in the rain is. 

Rich Bennett 44:53
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 44:53
Victory no matter what happens, what the outcome. But, you know, we're competitive. We want to win, win all the time, right. At everything. But it's about putting it into perspective. Like this is this is amateur boxing and this is 

Rich Bennett 45:06
Huh? 

Patrick Casey 45:06
more or less a hobby. It's kind of like glorified sparring where we're all well protected. It's three rounds. You have an official and judges. So just go have fun. Let loose. Don't be so tidy 

Rich Bennett 45:16
hmm. 

Patrick Casey 45:16
and uptight about it, you know? So it's been cool, man. It's been a good time. And it's cool because the camaraderie, you would think you're slugging out with a guy, but the love in the in the hugging and the camaraderie afterwards, 

Rich Bennett 45:27
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 45:28
it's so cool, man. And everybody knows everybody. So it's like it's own network. 

Rich Bennett 45:33
I went up against a Golden Glove boxer one time. 

Patrick Casey 45:38
Yeah, that's probably enough. 

Rich Bennett 45:39
That's all I need to be was was it was back at the Marine Corps where I was stationed that we. Yeah, we just had a little competition. I like you're Europe and the guy was going against Jersey and Yeah former Golden Gloves boxer I'm like oh crap. 

Patrick Casey 45:53
Yeah, I've 

Rich Bennett 45:53
And 

Patrick Casey 45:53
been. 

Rich Bennett 45:53
he was shorter to me. But 

Patrick Casey 45:55
Yeah, I've been 

Rich Bennett 45:55
they. 

Patrick Casey 45:56
I've been sparring with a kid who's who's over at West Point. He comes into town and his dad, his dad's a coach Dos. His dad hooked us up, and we do some sparring, but he's, you know, 20 years younger than me. But it's it's just. It's just fun. It's a good time. 

Rich Bennett 46:08
She said, Even though I got my ass beat it. it. It felt good because I never you know, as far as there's a difference between boxing and fighting. 

I never done that. I got into plenty of fights. I've taken tae kwon do and all that. Boxing is completely different. But, man, even though I got my ass beat, I felt good. I mean, sounds weird, but. But I did. I felt good. 

Patrick Casey 46:38
The condition is I'm sitting here getting into them like two minute rounds. There's nothing. And I only have to do that three times. That's nothing, man. It is the biggest taxing thing I've ever done in my life. And I would play 90 minutes of soccer, 60 minutes of basketball, like whatever I go run miles and miles. But doing 6 minutes of boxing is is an animal in and of itself. 

Rich Bennett 47:00
People don't understand that. Even if you don't want to spar, boxing is such a great exercise. 

Patrick Casey 47:08
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 47:08
And I had a gentleman on here before and I never realized this, which is one of the reasons I had him on. He started a nonprofit and it's he has Parkinson's. And he was 

Patrick Casey 47:21
Mm 

Rich Bennett 47:21
talking 

Patrick Casey 47:21
hmm. 

Rich Bennett 47:21
about all these people with Parkinson's, that box, how it helps them. 

Patrick Casey 47:25
have a friend that does it. He's. He's in his sixties. He has Parkinson's and he we always talk about it Whenever I see him. We talk about boxing because they do the. It keeps their coordination and flexibility. 

Rich Bennett 47:35
Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah, it's. Oh, God. It just. 

Patrick Casey 47:41
I never would have thought of it either. 

Rich Bennett 47:43
No, no, I definitely did it. All right, Sir Patrick, I love to ask people this, especially somebody that's helping other people. Can you share a feel good story with us was about somebody that you have helped and it doesn't you don't have to mention their names or anything. 

Patrick Casey 48:04
One guy that I've been helping doing some coaching work with, he's been sober a long time, a couple of years longer than me. And this guy was, you know, isolated. He's been married three times. He works in the medical field, didn't have a lot of friends, wasn't dating anybody. And he's like, you know, I really like what you have. You know, I'd like to work with you and kind of you know, I don't want to do the recovery stuff, but I want to learn what that whatever the hell it is that you've been talking about for the last while. So about a year ago, I started working with them. And this guy now is he's dating. He's he's got a plethora of friends. He's doing all these service commitments, helping other people. Now. And he's then he's continued to have these breakthroughs. And the the biggest one was when he got divorced eight years ago. He he hasn't left the state of Florida for eight years, hadn't left the state. He got in his car and drove up to Virginia, hung out with a bunch of family members, went hiking and did all this stuff that he thought, there's no way I'm ever going to do any of this stuff because he was just in this tunnel and it just living in this kind of little shell. And I'm like, Dude, you've been sober so long. Like like you need to go live life and everything. You said, Michelle, he was like, this is this is difficult. This is hard. I don't I don't want to do this. Like, like I don't see how this is going to help. And I went through the the courtroom work with him and he was like, this is how am I like 59 years old? And I didn't know this stuff about myself. 

Rich Bennett 49:41
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 49:41
He's in the same, same position I was. To a much more extreme version of that where I was a couple of years ago. But again, this is a guy that was isolated, not really enjoying life, not exercising. And he's he's tall. He's like six, five. He was overweight and he's dropped a bunch of weight. He rides a bicycle now like he was afraid, literally afraid of exercise. So 

Rich Bennett 50:04
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 50:04
this guy has completely changed his life and turned it around. Now, this is not a life or death situation. Like, yeah, I've helped a lot of people get sober over the years. That was much more dire. But that's just an example of like what this kind of work can do for somebody, regardless of where you are in your life, regardless of your age, whether you have substance abuse or not. Is a guy that 59 years old, didn't know a lot about himself. You know, it's just kind of kind of pervade the victim mentality. We were talking are like, does anybody ever said anything to you about victim mentality saying, I've been seeing the same therapist one or two times a week? She's never mentioned the word victim to me before. 

Rich Bennett 50:44
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 50:44
Like you. You live in a victim mindset. You see everything through a victim's lens. 

Lights on, Michelle. So, you know, kind of like, you know, I think we all probably have those friends And it kind of goes back to what you were saying, Michel, about talking positive. Is that it's like we all have those friends that complain about stuff, right? You ask them how their vacation was, they might say one or two good things, and then it's all the negative things that happened on the vacation. It's like, did you actually have a good time? Like, you don't sound like you even. So we have 

Michelle Hayes 51:15
Right. 

Patrick Casey 51:15
those friends and they're stuck in that negative. They see everything through that negative lens. 

Rich Bennett 51:20
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And it's it's hard to stop, but 

Patrick Casey 51:24
It's. 

Rich Bennett 51:24
it can be 

Patrick Casey 51:25
It's 

Rich Bennett 51:25
done. 

Patrick Casey 51:25
an addiction. Elmo. 

Rich Bennett 51:27
Oh, my God. Thank. 

Patrick Casey 51:28
You're getting something out of it. The only reason you're doing these things is because you're getting something out of it. 

Rich Bennett 51:35
Damn, I never thought about that. Patrick, something very important. Tell people about these damn courses you offer. 

Patrick Casey 51:42
Yeah. So I got to like I said, JJ, you know, made me do things I didn't want to do, and I've gotten a lot of good response from it. It's awesome. You know, it's stuff that I definitely never would have done on my own if I wasn't encouraged and supported to do it. So my first one I did, I think back in June of last year, I did one called the Three Steps to Breaking Through Self-destructive Patterns, where I go through everything about, again, it's not just drugs and alcohol. What are the other things we do that are destructive, that are holding us back? So I go into three steps for that, and then I just did one recently. You may or may not like this play on words. It's called male ordered support, namely five Ways to Deliver Help to the Man in Your life. So that was kind of a fun play on words. And so that is about, you know, it doesn't have to be men only. But obviously I can speak more for men because I am one. So it's about how do you help the guy that struggling, you know, because 

Rich Bennett 52:33
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 52:34
through doing this coaching work, I've had so many ladies come up to me and say, How do I get my husband to to like, like work with somebody like you? How do I get my son or my nephew or my my boyfriend or whatever the case is, Or I have this guy friend. How do I get them to, like, even see that they they need help? And I think you were talking about it with the ladies from Ashley on your last podcast 

Rich Bennett 52:53
hmm. 

Patrick Casey 52:53
about like, how do you help people and you can't pressure them into doing it. But the biggest thing is to be a role model. And the more they see you doing those things, it's like you said, it becomes attractive, you know, then 

Rich Bennett 53:04
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 53:04
they get negativity can be attractive or the positivity can be attractive. And so I go I go into ways in which to do that. And the more the more part about it that I love the most is, is towards the end of my course, I really tap into masculinity and femininity and the energy differences with those and how we have those and how we need those in our relationships to make our relationships kind of work better. Because I have been 

Rich Bennett 53:25
Right. 

Patrick Casey 53:25
married before. We were together for ten years. I was married for four years and we divorced in 2016, which again is obviously why I waited so long to get engaged again. But I learned so much through that marriage that I vowed I'm not going to repeat this. And so I really dug into what the hell is masculinity, really? What is femininity, really, and how do those 

Rich Bennett 53:45
Right. 

Patrick Casey 53:45
things work to have that polarity in relationship so that now I treat Caitlyn like a lover rather than 

Rich Bennett 53:52
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 53:52
just a pal? Because when I was married towards the end, we were just roommates. We were just. Hey, 

Rich Bennett 53:58
Yes. 

Patrick Casey 53:58
what's up? We're just pals. And so now, like, you know, I still do things like, surprise her. I still, like, you know, keep her guessing. I said, Hey, put on something nice. We're going to go out. Where are we going? You'll see. When we get there, we go see this awesome show. And she's like, Oh, that was awesome. That was a great night. It was wonderful. And and she gets all lit up again like she did on our first couple of dates. So it's about keeping that alive again because it's so easy 

Rich Bennett 54:17
Keep 

Patrick Casey 54:18
to. 

Rich Bennett 54:18
the spark going, man. 

Patrick Casey 54:19
Dude, it's so easy to get complacent and stagnant and just let myself go. And and so think I. We do a lot of the same hobbies and all the fitness stuff. And then and then we do a lot of the same emotional, spiritual work, and we're kind of similar journeys. So it's been really helpful in having the two participants that both want it make it work. So I'm kind of figuring out a lot of that stuff. And, you know, I somebody told me the other day, like, not only obviously is that the divorce rate super high, but people who get married a second time, the divorce rate is even higher. 

Rich Bennett 54:51
Wow. 

Patrick Casey 54:52
That that blew me away. It was like 63% or something of people that get married a second time get 

Michelle Hayes 54:56
So 

Patrick Casey 54:56
divorced. 

Michelle Hayes 54:56
high. 

Patrick Casey 54:57
I don't want to. Ended up end 

Rich Bennett 54:59
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 54:59
up like that. You know, we all know people that are in miserable relationships. It's like, why are you guys even together? You guys are fucking this. 

Rich Bennett 55:05
Yeah. 

Michelle Hayes 55:05
I'm in the same boat with you. In my second marriage, you know. Thank. 

Rich Bennett 55:09
Oh. 

Michelle Hayes 55:11
Thank goodness I'm in my second marriage. Thank you. I think the second one's better. 

Patrick Casey 55:14
Yeah. Yeah. And I have. 

Michelle Hayes 55:15
At least it was for me. 

Patrick Casey 55:17
And I have all the all the, you know, hope in and guarantee in the world that this is going to be beautiful. 

Rich Bennett 55:23
Yeah, but you do. You do have to keep the spark alive. And, you know, when it comes to marriage. You or your partner may not like the same things. Sometimes you got to step out of your comfort zone. My wife and I have been married for 27 years now, and this past weekend she wanted to go to an antique store. And then. Well, first to a crazy in an antique store. And then we were headed to Costco. And she said, Are you sure you want to go look here? I had a blast, especially in the antique store. Oh, my God. Good thing I didn't take a lot of money with me. 

Patrick Casey 56:02
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 56:04
Or have a tractor trailer because we will have. lot of furniture. I was kind of upset that the guy didn't have any more microphones, but that's okay, you know? But she's, you know, afterwards she's like I didn't think you'd really want to do that. Oh, that was. Yeah, We went to an estate sale first. 

Patrick Casey 56:20
Oh, nice. 

Rich Bennett 56:21
Yeah, because she when she sees an estate sale online, she's like, honey in the States. I said, No, 

Patrick Casey 56:27
hmm. 

Rich Bennett 56:28
don't look till you get rid of. But she's like, I'm surprised you went with music. Yeah, why not? Let's see what they had. 

Patrick Casey 56:35
Yeah. And I, you know, I know she likes to go into musicals and shows, and so I've been, I've been picking some and I'm not big with that, but I've been taking 

Rich Bennett 56:41
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 56:41
some. Actually put on by local kids, high schools and middle schools. 

Rich Bennett 56:45
Oh, those are 

Patrick Casey 56:45
And 

Rich Bennett 56:45
all. 

Patrick Casey 56:46
they're fun. They're actually like, 

Rich Bennett 56:47
Yes. 

Patrick Casey 56:47
we just did Shrek the Musical, and it was hilarious. It was so funny. And I think we did School of the School of Rock before 

Rich Bennett 56:54
School of 

Patrick Casey 56:54
that. 

Rich Bennett 56:55
Rock. 

Patrick Casey 56:55
Like, that was hilarious. So it's like 

Rich Bennett 56:56
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 56:56
it's a good compromise. So I'm always kind of like peeking for those things. 

Rich Bennett 57:01
Oh, yeah, You have to. What was it? I remember when we first started dating. We. The first concert her and I went to together was Yanni. 

Patrick Casey 57:12
Wow. 

Couple of years ago. 

Rich Bennett 57:16
But it was well, it was a long time ago, says Live at Acropolis Tour. And I loved Johnny. I mean, because he used to play in a heavy metal band. That's how he got his start, you know, is like, okay, let's do it. And it was lawn seats. And then halfway through during intermission, this guy came up and gave us pavilion tickets, like third row back center. To this day, still one of the best concerts I ever been to because he did some solo stuff. So his fiddle player, 

Patrick Casey 57:47
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 57:47
violin player, whatever did a solo would blow Charlie Daniels away. 

Patrick Casey 57:52
Lot. 

Rich Bennett 57:52
The bass player, Patrick, you're going to love this. The bass player did a solo. Would have made Flea look like a beginner. 

Patrick Casey 58:00
Really? 

Rich Bennett 58:01
Yes. I mean, he his concert was just it was even though it's I don't even think he calls his music New Age, but it was like you're at a rock concert, you know, and but yet at the same time, we've been to some other things like we've seen. Oh, God, I forgot. Oh, Travis Tritt. 

Patrick Casey 58:20
Okay? 

Rich Bennett 58:21
Yes. Travis Tritt will go see Trans-Siberian Orchestra. 

Patrick Casey 58:25
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 58:25
I cannot get her to go see Kiss, but. 

Michelle Hayes 58:28
Although Libya. 

Rich Bennett 58:29
Too late. Well, too late now. Well, they're dying. 

Michelle Hayes 58:33
Rude. 

Patrick Casey 58:34
Yeah, well. 

Rich Bennett 58:35
They're done. 

Michelle Hayes 58:36
You could've taken me. 

Rich Bennett 58:38
I never look, I've only seen kiss twice, and both times I've seen them. It was without their makeup. I've I've always wanted to see them with their makeup and never did. 

Patrick Casey 58:48
Yeah, that would be cool. Yeah. I mean, she's got me into some punch, some country stuff because I was never a country fan. So there's a couple couple country bands I've seen that I like and like. Very cool. I get that with this. 

Rich Bennett 58:58
Can you expand 

Patrick Casey 58:58
Just 

Rich Bennett 58:58
your horizons? 

Patrick Casey 58:58
try new things. Yeah. 

Michelle Hayes 59:00
I like telling him to plan nights like we were going to work tonight. And I was like, No, we're not working tonight. You're gonna plan whatever we do tonight, but we're not going to be in the office. We're not going to work. We'll work some hours tomorrow to make up for it. But you planned something, and I haven't heard from him all afternoon, so I'm slightly, slightly scared. 

Patrick Casey 59:22
Did he plan or did you forget? Right. 

Michelle Hayes 59:25
Don't know. But if he did. 

Rich Bennett 59:27
Busy with work, Michelle. 

Michelle Hayes 59:29
Oh, yeah, sure. No, it's Friday. You probably had a happy hour with the guys at work. 

Rich Bennett 59:36
That's work. 

Michelle Hayes 59:37
Speakeasy room at work. They had a liquor license for his office at 

Patrick Casey 59:41
Oh. 

Michelle Hayes 59:41
the. I just have. 

Rich Bennett 59:42
He's probably. 

Michelle Hayes 59:43
Fridge. 

Rich Bennett 59:44
He's probably talking about just how. Patrick, where's the book coming out, man? 

Patrick Casey 59:48
Yeah. A couple of people have been kind of telling me you need to write a book. And, you know, 

Rich Bennett 59:52
huh. 

Patrick Casey 59:53
I'm just like, This is just my life. What do you mean? I need to write a book? But, yeah, well, see, it's on the list. It's on the list of many things that I want to do one day. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:02
Here's the thing, and I've told other other people this. You know what you said, It's just your life. But with everything you've been through, I think even if you write a memoir about your life, it can also be a guidebook for people. And it'll help other people because, I mean, you've been on several different podcasts talking, talking about your, you know, helping other people. But the book, too, is just something else. It and then you can start your own podcast. 

Patrick Casey 1:00:32
Yeah. Some people have mentioned those. It's just. Yeah. Avenues for, you know, being of service being. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:38
Everybody's giving you more work, aren't they? 

Patrick Casey 1:00:40
Yeah. Back off. Have some. 

Take it easy. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:44
So if somebody wants to take your course, how do they how do they get in touch with you? 

Patrick Casey 1:00:49
Probably the easiest 

Rich Bennett 1:00:50
Mm hmm. 

Patrick Casey 1:00:50
way is 

Rich Bennett 1:00:50
Oh. 

Patrick Casey 1:00:51
Patrick Casey, junior icon. So Patrick Casey, J.R. and my last name is spelled Casey Y. So Patrick Casey, junior icon on there. You'll see the two courses. They're both free. They're both roughly about 60 minutes. And then towards the bottom, you actually have access to a bunch of the podcasts I have then on and then it 

Rich Bennett 1:01:12
Mm 

Patrick Casey 1:01:12
takes 

Rich Bennett 1:01:12
hmm. 

Patrick Casey 1:01:12
you to my YouTube channel where I have about ten or 11 of the podcasts that I've been featured on, such as I'll be at this one when this one comes out too. So, you know, it's a good, good platform. And then I'm on Instagram, Patrick Casey Jr and I do have a Facebook group called Advocates for Men's Support as well. So I'm on I'm on Facebook. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:30
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 1:01:31
Patrick Dempsey, J.R. So several, several ways to get a hold of me. And on my website I have a free calendar on there for free consultation. So if you just want to talk, see if I'm a fit, we can see if each other's a fit, because the last thing I want to do is take someone's money. If, you know, first off, they're not willing to do the work. And a lot of time that that, you know, is having hit some kind of bottom. Otherwise you're not going to be willing to do things that are difficult and hard. So you want to make sure that the person is willing to do the work. Otherwise everybody's wasting their time. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:02
Well, you definitely have to come back going again, because when we do 

God, we got to do another virtual roundtable on recovery and one on mental health. So I definitely would join them. And well, you know what? Help the door's open, man. Any time you want to. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:24
Yeah, I'd love to. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:25
We'll jam. By then I'll be playing bass. You can. You don't. I would just. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:30
Yeah. Perfect. I'll hook up. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:32
And Michelle 

Patrick Casey 1:02:32
sure I can. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:33
and Michelle can play her Clapper. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:35
To the computer. 

Michelle Hayes 1:02:37
My son. You played the violin and the automaton. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:40
The white. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:42
At home. 

Michelle Hayes 1:02:43
And. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:43
What does that? 

Patrick Casey 1:02:44
How do you spell? 

Michelle Hayes 1:02:44
You've never seen it. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:46
How do you spell that? 

Michelle Hayes 1:02:47
No. 

Patrick Casey 1:02:48
Automaton. 

Michelle Hayes 1:02:49
Yeah. It's like this thing you see all over. Like, I guess it's on TikTok, but it's on, like, Facebook reels and stuff, and it's the one that looks like face and you squeeze it. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:00
Huh? 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:01
You guys have never seen it. 

Patrick Casey 1:03:02
No, I don't think so. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:05
It's it's a lot. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:06
Are you making this? 

Patrick Casey 1:03:06
I'll definitely be looking. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:07
No, I'm not. He got one for Christmas. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:10
Okay. 

Patrick Casey 1:03:11
So it's small little hand-held thing. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:13
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:14
But it looks. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:14
Japanese. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:17
A really. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:18
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:19
Ooh. I may be interested in getting one of them. Michelle, do you have any questions before I ask Patrick my last question. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:27
No, sir, I do not. 

Patrick Casey 1:03:32
She got all she needs. 

Michelle Hayes 1:03:34
Yeah, I think so. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:36
So, Patrick, is there anything you like that before I ask you my next question? 

Patrick Casey 1:03:41
No, I don't think so. I think, you know, just trying to. Do that, do the work of helping people. You know, just if you need help, you know, find it somewhere, just like I was told, like, you know, go ahead and get help. Even if it's not with me. Get help from somebody. Just. No. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:56
Mm hmm. 

Patrick Casey 1:03:56
Life is too damn short. Stop being miserable. Go get. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:00
Right. And. And enjoy it, man. Enjoy life. Align yourself of all that positive stuff, man. 

Patrick Casey 1:04:05
LAUGHTER Have fun. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:06
You know, look at the good News network or something. I mean, just look up all the good stuff, 

Patrick Casey 1:04:11
Stop. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:11
you know, make a difference. 

Patrick Casey 1:04:12
News? Yes. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:13
Yeah. Yeah. Stop watching the news. Pick up a good book. Read it. 

Michelle Hayes 1:04:17
We like. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:18
You a. 

Michelle Hayes 1:04:18
It is in our office. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:21
Funny 

Patrick Casey 1:04:21
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:22
how? 

Patrick Casey 1:04:22
Like what? 

Michelle Hayes 1:04:22
Clean your desk day and National Cat Day and Hot Chocolate Day and all the fun ones. 

Patrick Casey 1:04:29
Opposite day. Is there? 

Michelle Hayes 1:04:30
Those are fun. I work with my husband, so it's going to be interesting. 

Patrick Casey 1:04:35
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:37
God. So, Patrick, what is the next big thing for Patrick Casey? 

Patrick Casey 1:04:44
Probably a TED talk. What do you think? 

Rich Bennett 1:04:46
Oh. 

Hell, yes. I think you should 

Patrick Casey 1:04:53
Yeah. I think the next. The next. Yeah, I'm actually I started a meetup group, so a men's meetup group here in town. So I got about seven or eight guys signed up on that. So I'm hoping to kind of do that to, to do some local in-person stuff too. And like I said, go to 

Rich Bennett 1:05:09
write. 

Patrick Casey 1:05:09
some of the rehabs. I think it would be really cool. It's to kind of get some flow going with doing workshops at the drug and alcohol substance abuse rehabs and then actually like travel to other places to other rehabs to do 

Rich Bennett 1:05:20
Like 

Patrick Casey 1:05:20
the. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:20
the Ashley. 

Patrick Casey 1:05:21
Yeah. And for free. I'm not doing it for money for free. But maybe I could pick up clients along the way, too, when they get out of treatment. And it's kind of the hope and share some of this material. So I think that's the. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:31
Yeah. That'd be awesome. And the thing with the TED talk, I know it's hard to it's hard to get on one of those stages for Ted talk, but you can schedule all a TED talk X, I believe. 

Patrick Casey 1:05:44
Yeah, Yeah. I've seen people talk about it, and I think they have all these. Yeah. I mean, obviously seeing that in just. But yeah, I think there's a bunch of. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:50
Oh, I thought your being. 

Patrick Casey 1:05:51
Requirements and things. Maybe down the road, maybe that'd be a cool big thing, but. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:55
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 1:05:56
I don't know. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:57
Why not do it? 

Patrick Casey 1:05:59
Never thought I'd be boxing. I never thought I would be on a podcast. Never thought I'd be doing hell. A lot of the things that I do. So. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:05
Exactly. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:06
That's one thing I learned in sobriety that one of my first mentors told me, Never say never and never say always. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:14
Oh, I never heard the never say always. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:16
say always, you know. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:17
Never say never. I hear all the time 

Patrick Casey 1:06:19
Like 

Rich Bennett 1:06:19
and rest. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:19
this. I'm always going to do this. It's always going to be like that. You're always going to do this. Like he said, 

Rich Bennett 1:06:24
Yeah. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:24
never say always and never say never. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:27
I like that. You need to put that on a shirt. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:32
Never say never on the front and never say always 

Rich Bennett 1:06:34
Never 

Patrick Casey 1:06:34
on the. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:35
say always on the back there you get with your website on there. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:37
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:38
Okay, Forget that marketing, man. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:40
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:40
I mean, Patrick, thanks a lot. 

Patrick Casey 1:06:43
Thanks, Reg. Appreciate it. Thank you, Michele. 

Michelle Hayes 1:06:45
Absolutely. 

Rich Bennett 1:06:47
Thank you for listening to the conversations with Rich Bennett. I hope you enjoy today's episode and learn something from it as I did. If you'd like to hear more conversations like this, be sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode. And if you have a moment, I'd love if you could leave a review. It helps us reach more listeners and share more incredible stories. Don't forget to connect with us on social media or visit our website at conversations with Rich Bennett dot com for updates, giveaways and more. Until next time, take care, be kind and keep the conversations going.