Music, Cancer, and Cherishing Every Moment with Ray Hartjen

Rich Bennett 0:00
Thanks for joining the conversation where we explore the stories and experiences that shape our world. I'm your host, Rick Bennett. And today we're joined by a truly inspiring guest. Ray Hart. John Bray is the author of iMac. Now, first of all, when I mention this title, those of you that live here, I just want to specify that Ray is not from Pittsburgh. 

So those Ravens fans, just be sure that you remember that part. He is the author of Immaculate How the Steelers Saved Pittsburgh and the Deeply Personal Me, myself and my multiple multiple Myeloma. Beyond his accomplishments as an author, Ray is also a passionate musician and a vocal advocate for cancer patient support. He's here to share how his battle with multiple myeloma has influenced his life philosophy and led to powerful insights about cherishing every moment. So join me as we explore Ray's journey and the lessons he's learned about the power of a positive mindset. 

Ray Hartjen 1:06
Thank you so much, Rich, for having me on the show and looking forward to join in conversations and you and your audience. So thank you for the opportunity. Appreciate. 

Rich Bennett 1:14
I just want to clear the air here, because I know a lot of my listeners, me being from Baltimore and you write in the book about the Pittsburgh Steelers, 

you're not from Pittsburgh. But what why was it that you wrote that book? And it is true. I do believe the Steelers did save Pittsburgh. 

Ray Hartjen 1:34
Yeah. You know, it's, um. It's a good question, Rich, you know, as you know, but your listeners don't know yet. I'm not from Pittsburgh, I'm from Texas originally, and I grew up as a dutiful Texan. I'm 60 years old. So like in the seventies, you know, as a as a good Texan, the Cowboys were my favorite. And then, you know, being in Texas, my second favorite team was the Houston Oilers. And then, you know, my third favorite team was my mama's favorite team. And my mama like everybody else's mama, like Kenny Stabler or the Oakland Raiders. So the Raiders are my third, right? So, you know, back in the seventies, the Steelers were gum on my shoes, much like, you know, sometimes the Steelers are gum on all you Ravens fan shoes now and you know they they very famously beat the Cowboys in two Super Bowls. They very famously knocked out the Houston Oilers in the playoffs twice. And the Oilers never could win a AFC Central title is what it was called then. And then they, you know, very famously beat the Raiders in three different playoff games, you know, So I a while I was a fan of the Cowboys at the time. You know, I hated the Pittsburgh Steelers, but you know and that's what happens when you're a kid right you love and. 

Rich Bennett 2:44
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 2:45
Then over the years I grew to respect the way that they played football, but I wouldn't have called myself a fan. But then us forward up until now is a much older adult. You know, I met a friend of mine, he's the coach, Tom Olynyk, and Tom is the Inter. He's from Pittsburgh. And, you know, for years he has kind of played around with this thesis that, you know, Pittsburgh had to go through a very painful de-industrialisation transformation and, you know, somehow came out the other end smelling like a rose. I mean, Pittsburgh is a much different city today than it was 50 

Rich Bennett 3:17
Got 

Ray Hartjen 3:17
years. 

Rich Bennett 3:17
you. 

Ray Hartjen 3:18
It's a you know, a leader in academia, medical research, health care, robotics and other technologies, you know, much So, you know, they come out of this deindustrialization transformations kind of small like rose when compared to other Rust Belt cities like, you know, Cleveland and Detroit, you know, Virginia, Youngstown, Gary, Indiana, and the Lakes, you know, And in his mind, it was like, you know, what galvanized the city when it was facing its toughest time. And all of a sudden was the Pittsburgh Steelers, who in 1972 became good for the first time in their history. You know, from 1933 to 1971, they were the best description you could give them was mediocre, But many times they were just horrible. I mean, they were the chiefs. I don't know. They were like the unknown. I don't want to say everyone's a book buyer, right? So I don't want to say it, but they were a perpetually struggling team and all of a sudden it's unlikely, you know, kind of a situation where the city can look at like, wow, they're good. And, you know, and they're built in the mirror image, you know, blue collar, you know, bring your lunch pail to work type of football. But Tom's not a writer, and Tom's a biotech exec. And he had this idea and he would just, like, talk about it. He talked about with his family for 25 years, and he talked about it with me for like ten years. And then one day I just looked at him, say, Tom, and if not now, when? You know, this makes a this isn't going to be a great book. Or it could be a great book. Let's get started on it. Let's get started. And if it should ever veer off of your vision, we'll stop. Well, it never veered it. We never stopped and we did. So it's a book that we're proud of. And the fact that, you know, it's it's part football book, part history book. But the way that we we even the stories, I think it entertains whether you're a reader of history or you're a sports fan. 

Rich Bennett 5:05
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 5:06
For you, right. So I kind of viewed as a collection of like, you know, 60, 70 campfire stories that we kind of weave together to to progress through the years. And it's a book I'm proud of. But, hey, like, you know, you and I have talked before, Rich, you know, I love the Ravens and Steelers football games. I understand the neighborhood you're coming from, but don't hate me. I'm just the writer. Don't kill the messenger. Right. You know. 

Rich Bennett 5:33
I have to laugh because every time, every football season. So like I said, my son's a big Ravens fan. My best friend's son is a Steelers fan. 

Ray Hartjen 5:43
No. 

Rich Bennett 5:44
Watch these two online, go back and forth about it. It's a 

now it's weird. It's almost like. The Civil War. Sorry. Sorry. Holy cow. Guys, come on. It's only a game. 

Ray Hartjen 5:59
But 

Rich Bennett 5:59
What do you. 

Ray Hartjen 6:00
it is a good one, a type. 

Rich Bennett 6:02
Oh, it is. 

Ray Hartjen 6:04
Go at it game and it's you and I are both to go from that old school era and it's it's old school football. You're not going to see 66, 63. You're going to see a lot more 20 to 17. You know, guys really selling out, going for those tackles and the blocks really physical. And I love watching that game. It's a it's a highlight for me. And I love it when it's on prime time and then know we've had those years in the 2000 where they've been playoff games and nothing's better than a Steeler Ravens playoff game. 

Rich Bennett 6:30
Oh, yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 6:31
Right. So so that's a lot of fun. And so, you know that that part of that if not now when that came from being diagnosed with the blood cancer, multiple myeloma and you know it really changed my outlook on my my outlook on life and that that you I know I don't want to procrastinate. You do things like that, right. You know, we all know how much time we have left. But when we get meat, for me, you know, having a diagnosis of multiple myeloma, which if your listeners if you don't if you're not familiar with it, I wasn't familiar with it before March 11th, 2019. It's it's an incurable blood cancer, a cancer that manifest itself in your in your bone marrow. And, you know, I, I, you know, it took a couple of weeks. It was kind of like a slap in the face. It's like, hey, you know, before that, I was going to live forever rich, you know, And I took things for granted. So I wanted to begin to realize the perils of taking things or the things you want to do that you know, let's get done now. And so that was, you know, led me to the motto of if not now, when? You know. So when I grabbed Tom by the shoulders and kind of gave him little shook and, you know, literally it was like calm. If not now when you know, you've been talking about this for 25 years, 26 years, and going to make it a better story, let's get to it now. So, you know, that was a kind of a big turning point in getting that accomplished and getting some other things done. 

Rich Bennett 7:51
So when you got diagnosed, how did that actually transform your outlook on life? 

Ray Hartjen 7:59
Yeah, you know, it's a good question and thanks for asking it. You know, at first it's like, you know, all right, let's let's fight. You know, some cancer patients 

Rich Bennett 8:07
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 8:07
have a journey, then some cancer patients have a fight. And for me, the fighting metaphor works best, right? And and so for me, I'm like, hey, you know, I didn't ask for this. You know, multiple myeloma came knocking on my door. But okay, so but I can home court advantage for playing by neighborhood rules. Let's get at it. Right. And so, you know, I approached it in that kind of a fight mentality and everything that I've done in my career, my life has always been built around some sort of capstone event, some sort of milestone event. So, you know, academically it would be maybe an exam, you know, at work deliverable or project athletically, it would be a race or a game, you know, a musician, maybe a gig or something. So there'll be no rehearsals, practices, study, but it would be a capstone event. And I kind of approached cancer from the very beginning in that kind of fight. Right? You know, it's like, you know, and it wore me out because rich men, when you're dealing with a chronic illness, whether it's multiple myeloma, heart disease, diabetes, 

Rich Bennett 9:00
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 9:00
where there is no fight night, there is no game day, Every night is fight night, Every day is game day. Right. So for me, you know, I, I learned very quickly I had to change my approach to deal with my health, that there was no like training camp mentality. After two weeks, I was exhausted. My family no went out to dinner on a Friday night about, you know, maybe, you know, just shy of two weeks of being diagnosed. And I was at war more now, physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. And that's when I needed to readjust the way that I thought about approaching things. I needed to be more sustainable. What can I do to, like, say, physically to help me with my mental emotional state? Or what can I do spiritually with my mental illness, kind of push all those levels up? And then that kind of that was the first step in me learning from cancer, you know, having a growth mindset and going, No, it contains cancer, teach me or what do I need to do? Learn what? What do I need to, you know, what do I need to do differently? And that was one of the things I need to unlearn. Just kind of training camp mentality. Then step into something and let's go and talk. You know, as I began thinking about things. You know, soon thereafter, I began to understand, like, you know, I took things for granted too much. I and I don't think I'm, you know, I want to really speak to your listeners here and that I don't think that's unique to me. In a way, I think it might be kind of endemic of the human condition is like, you know, for me, I'll just talk to me personally and hopefully something will resonate with somebody or listeners. But, you know, it used to take all tomorrows for granted. Tomorrow was going to write, you know, and I and certainly next week, next month, next year, and in some instances, next decades even, You know, it was and people say that to him. So someday I'm going to write, you know, are you actually doing it to get to dot, dot, dot. Right. And you let this time kind of slip away. And so, you know, I recognize the perils and that of taking time for granted. And part of taking time for granted. What what precipitated from that or what multiplied from that was taking people in relationships. Because, you know, if like your friend who I love and care for, you know, but I think about you, Rich, I'm like, you know, he'll be here tomorrow, you know. 

Rich Bennett 11:16
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 11:17
Too busy today because I'm dealing with some, you know, something, some little tiny things. But, you know, Richie's important. And you. I'll get through the next week or whatever. And, you know, I begin to realize that, you know, I took time for granted because it took time for connected people in a relationship for granted. So that that really what what do I want to do and with whom do I want to do it with? You know, and I wanted to fast forward that up. So now I'll interject. I know your son's a wizard guitar player. I'm a I'm a Hammond. 

I'm a ham and nigger. But, you know, at our gigs, you know, we get paid for our gigs. That's great. But we get paid more when we can sell something. People 

Rich Bennett 11:55
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 11:55
don't buy. People don't buy CDs anymore, but they buy T-shirts. Right. And so for years, decades, I've thought about what's a cool little scene to put on a t shirt so people will buy it, right? You know? And so if not now, when became one, but then the other one came. And the one that I use most often is punch today in the face. 

Rich Bennett 12:14
I love. 

Ray Hartjen 12:15
Yeah. And for me, it's, you know, Rich, today is a gift. It is a gift for all of us. And not everybody received the gift today. Unfortunately. So what can I do today to use today? You know, in the old cowboy terminology, you know, ride your horse hard. Put her up. What? Right. You know, I want to wear today out. I want today to know that I was here. And if anyone's ever been punched in the face, I kind of grabbed your attention right away. Right. So I want to I want to punch today in the face. I want to get today's attention. I want to use today up. So when I'm laying in bed at night, I can feel this sense of joy and satisfaction. I accomplish some things. I can lean over and kind of figuratively look over at tomorrow, give tomorrow a little wink, an appointment. I'm coming for you next, you know. So what can I do today to use it up to honor the day, To honor all those people did not receive the gift of the day and to honor myself. Let's go out and punch today in the face. 

Rich Bennett 13:13
I love that. I just. I'm a big, big fan of modern and. I think those are your start. You're seeing that more and more on t shirts. Those are what? People love now is the T-shirts with the mottos. Not necessarily the big band design all that, although you're seeing a lot of younger people buy them now, they don't even know who the band is. Oh. 

Ray Hartjen 13:39
I think that's you know, I actually got the idea from Sammy Hagar, you know, Sammy Hagar before he joined Van Halen had, you know, you know, the typical kind of like, you know, album or tour. 

Rich Bennett 13:48
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 13:49
In the back three words Hagar kicks ass. You know, it was an attitudinal thing and it was about the time, you know. I know you're a sports entertainment fan, pro wrestling. You know, it's during the time of the attitudinal era of the WWE. WCW known was D-Generation X and things like that. It was the. It was the attitude more than the, you know, the logo or whatever. So when the band's out, my band's The Chronic Padres, you know, we have a pretty cool logo. But is that cool enough for the shirt is cool enough and get a little attitude on the on the on the shirt, you know? Punch today in the face is like, Ooh, you know, that's worth somebody 20 bucks to 

Rich Bennett 14:28
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 14:28
buy. And that puts a little bit more food on my table. So, yeah, mottos are great and for me, I just like to be reminded of some things and I think Back to the Dead Poets Society, that movie you know, from. 

Rich Bennett 14:39
Oh, 

Ray Hartjen 14:40
Late eighties and, you know, just that simple Latin phrase, carpe diem, you know, seize the day. You know, how many times does that change people's lives when they're like, you know, it's much like, you know, punch you in the face, like seize today, you know? 

Rich Bennett 14:53
yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 14:53
You know, when Robin Williams takes that class, you know, at that private school to to the lobby and he's showing all these pictures of these people, and he said, what do all these people have in common? You know, and what they have become is they're all. You know, they don't they don't have they don't have. Today. You did seize the day, you know, And he's whispering behind them, Carpe carpe diem. I'm getting goosebumps thinking about it. Right. Think little mottos like that, no need to adopt them and, you know, continue to use them in your head. It can and cannot be reframed some things. Right. And does all need a little reframing. You know it's it's hard on all the time. Right. And so, you know, what are these little mottos, little phrases or, you know, maybe it's a tattoo, a symbol, a reminder for you that snaps you back and helps you reframe your day. 

Rich Bennett 15:42
And Ray just let you know. Hey, you are still kicking ass, man. I don't care how old he is, that bad still kicks ass and. 

Ray Hartjen 15:52
He. 

Rich Bennett 15:53
You. Awesome. 

Ray Hartjen 15:54
I. I think he might be the biggest winner ever of life. I mean, he not only if you just stop his career with mantras, that's great. Then he's a solo artist. That's awesome. Van Halen. That's awesome. Back as a solo artist, awesome. He's got two other bands, The Circle and Chickenfoot. He's in the in the seventies. First of all, let's not forget that the Tequila company he founded and sold. Billion dollars. The rum company that is now utilizing, you know, and I don't know if you ever seen Sammy in concert you go to that he still is slowed down a little bit but he puts on a great show in his. 

Rich Bennett 16:32
Oh, yeah. It still says he still sounds awesome. 

Ray Hartjen 16:37
Great entertainer, great musician, great singer, and a pretty cool guy. From all accounts, I've 

Rich Bennett 16:42
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 16:42
never met. But. But I would like to meet him because he seems like. 

Rich Bennett 16:45
Oh, yeah. If you ever get it. If you haven't watched it, Watch his show on AXS TV. 

Ray Hartjen 16:50
Oh, yeah. Hey, guys. Good 

Rich Bennett 16:52
Yes. Oh, 

Ray Hartjen 16:53
luck. 

Rich Bennett 16:53
man. Excellent show. Excellent show. So with with the multiple myeloma, 

because I'm not very familiar with it and I know a lot of my listeners are. What led you to go to the doctor to get checked out? 

Ray Hartjen 17:11
Yeah. A great question and something I certainly want to explore. For me, it was a routine blood test. A rich. 

Rich Bennett 17:18
Wow. 

Ray Hartjen 17:19
It came back with a anemic value. I was low in hemoglobin, and that's the first abnormal blood test on our head. I felt great. I mean, and looking back, you know, maybe I was a bit fatigued, but at the time I was 54 years old. I had a full time job, married two kids and expensive private universities. Give me a break. I think I deserved a degree. But, you know, I am also a cyclist, a road cyclist. I know being one, you know, kind of, you know, familiar with my performance metrics, you know, athletically and the performance metrics on the bike. I was playing it you know, I was doing my metrics as good as the previous five years. And but I had this anemic value. So we just went through this. It was a long period interrupted by I had a bike accident and that kind of set things back a while and the holidays came in busy time professionally. But by the time we began to to, you know, go through more sophisticated tests, more sophisticated tests, it ultimately ended up in a bone marrow biopsy. Pro-tip For you and your listeners, bone marrow biopsy is not to be considered recreationally or as a hobby. They're uncomfortable. But that that showed in March of 2019, 90% of my bone marrow. It's like. 

Rich Bennett 18:36
90%. 

Ray Hartjen 18:37
90%. So, you know, when I was first diagnosed, people are, you know, just inundated with offers like, do what can I do for you? And I'm like, no, I think I'm I think I'm okay. Thank you. But I don't I don't need anything right now. But I kept getting it from all sorts of people all around the world, actually. And and then I developed the list because I got asked so many times and, you know, it's been interviewed. You know, I had the opportunity, the privilege and the pleasure of participating in a lot of media interviews and videos and the like. And I was like, you know what? There is some things you can do for me, you know, as I'm speaking in these interviews, or I do have fundraising opportunities for organizations. And the first one of the four things well-rehearsed for me. First thing you can do is go see your doctor. I want to I want to emphasize once again, I was healthy. I felt good. And 90% of my bone marrow was cancerous. You know, so the earlier you can get started on something, the better you can get started on it. There's all sorts of it's not just multiple myeloma, it's heart disease, diabetes. It's all sorts. 

Rich Bennett 19:39
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 19:40
Get an find out. And I know sometimes it's inconvenient, sometimes are afraid and scared. Do yourself a favor. You know that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. But also, if you do something, the earlier interventions and actions are much easier than the later interventions that. So definitely go see your doctor and make it once a year at least and make sure you have a complete blood profile workup. I don't care if he needles or not. If you don't like needles, who cares? Suck it up. It doesn't hurt that bad. And you can get it done. Believe me, I don't like needles at all. And I get needles stuck on me nonstop. So do that. Go see your doctor. Number two. I call those the the tos and mitigate your risk factors And the twos. You don't need your doctor and you don't need research and tell you what those twos are. You already know. You drink too much, smoke too much, eat, too few vegetables and fruits, exercise too little, etc.. So I'm not saying don't live. I love my glass of bourbon just as much as Rich Benoit likes his glass of bourbon. But mitigate your risk factors to what you feel comfortable, right? Number three, if you ever know anybody going through a serious health issue alone, reach out to them. 

Rich Bennett 20:50
Yes. 

Ray Hartjen 20:50
It is a it's a daunting task in the United States. We have this mixed up, messed up system. My wife and I get more snail mail, U.S. postage mail in my mailbox from health care providers, pharmaceutical companies and health care payers, insurance companies where there's a ton of stuff. But then there's your meds, there's the shipping. I'm expecting chemotherapy meds to be shipped to the house today, you know, So you got all you got to look up for the meds cause you got to sign for them. You know, there's doctors appointments, it's a ton of stuff. And I'm lucky that my wife Lori handles so much of it for me. 

Rich Bennett 21:23
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 21:23
Daunting task. Now, I know what some of you are thinking. Some of you're thinking has pretty uncomfortable conversation. I don't even know what to say. And that's where you start. Because I've. I've lived my whole life. I've. Yeah, I've lived my whole life not knowing what to say at a lot of times. And so I didn't say, you know, somebody going through a hard 

situation with health. Just reach out. Hey, Rich, I love you. I care for you. I don't know what to say. I don't know what to say. But can we just work this out? Just 15 seconds are uncomfortable conversation. And then you and I are on the same train, and I'm going to be right there for you. And then the fourth thing. The final thing, find your cause. We are all in this together. It's the human condition, rather, We are all in this together. And it takes a village and we all get something. So find your health related cause and you will know what it is because it will speak to you. All of a sudden you'll say, You know what? It's St Jude Hospital or something like that. 

Rich Bennett 22:23
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 22:23
Don't donate your time, donate your money, donate both. And, you know, let's let's do this together because we we're village, we all need this together Hand in hand into this fight. Let's take action. Make things work. 

Rich Bennett 22:37
Something you said there. The third thing, the first three words I love you and I never understood is I don't know why a lot of people are free to see that. Me and my friends, every time we're if we're together, we leave. So I love you, brother. You need anything? Give it. It's it's part of our conversation, but we mean it when we say it to. And I for some reason I feel as if a lot of people I don't know if they find it weird if you say I love you to a friend or what? No, there's to me there's different types of love. 

Ray Hartjen 23:20
Oh, I knew. I knew. Love is a circle, right? You know, my love. But who else is different for love of somebody else? But I can understand. Like when I was. Like when I was younger, a younger man, you know, I was probably reticent to say, I love you. You know, there's a certain degree of vulnerability there, right? Like, I love you, Rich. You might not love me, but, you know, or. Or something like that. And so there's a that's that a little bit of, you know, vulnerability that for me as a young man, you know, like I said, I I'm 60 and, you know, grown up in the seventies and you know, a group of military family is cool, calm and collected. Make no mistake about it. You know, a military brother or sister loves their military brother and sister alongside them. Right. There is a love there. And and that, you know, that's what you do. That's why you do what you do in the military is not for yourself. That person right alongside you on either side, right. And but, you know, I don't know how much it was expressed. And so but you're right. Me and my friends now, you know, it's it's cool. It's okay to to show that the vulnerable, but also to express how you feel. You know, I'm and I love you and I care for you. You know, you know when you hurt, I hurt. You know, we have this psychological bond together. When you feel great, good. I feel good. You know, I want things to go well for you, and I want to do whatever it takes to make things go well for you. So. Yeah. And it is funny, me and my social groups, we didn't really do that 30 years ago, maybe 40 years not. But over time it's grown and it's deepened relationships. It's like, you know, opened it opened into another dimension. It's like, Yeah, you're right. We have a loving, caring relationship form or a supportive relationship or whatever. And it it just makes things more rich. And it'd be great if we did it more often. 

Rich Bennett 25:03
See, here's the thing, too. It goes with your one motto, Punch today in the face. Because that person may not be here tomorrow for you to say, I love you. 

So tell them. Tell them every time you see. 

Ray Hartjen 25:17
That's right. 

Rich Bennett 25:18
That. 

Ray Hartjen 25:19
Every chance you get. You thinking about them, reach out to them. 

Rich Bennett 25:22
Another thing I would like to add, if you don't mind, you know when because a lot of times when a friend or family member is diagnosed, whether it be with 

cancer, you know, some kind of strange disease, whatever. Yeah, a lot of people are afraid to go and talk to them. My take on that is if you don't know what to say still. Sit down with them. Listen, you know, it's always great to listen. And if they don't want to talk, you can still sit down with them. Because just being there with them is support enough to. 

But it is support, you know. 

Ray Hartjen 26:03
Yeah. You know, just let them know you're thinking about them. You go to Heybridge. You want to watch the game on TV tonight? 

Rich Bennett 26:11
Yeah. Let's watch Ravens kick the Steelers ass rich. 

Ray Hartjen 26:16
You know, just hold their hands, you know, sometimes, you know, with the relationships you have, you know, you can say a, you know, thousands of words without saying a word at all. Right. You know, and but, you know, one of the things I do like to tell people is, you know, don't be afraid to say that you don't know what to say, you know, and and that that's maybe the place to start. And then also for patients, you know, I, I, I've, I've come across a lot of people, you know, through support groups and the like. And it it pains me when they say this, but they you know, they say you find out who your friends are quickly. And I hope I never feel that way. But no but to each their own. And that's the way they feel. But, you know, every time I hear that, I try to encourage patients to say, you know, your road to diagnosis took a while and they kind of prepped you a little bit. Something was wrong. You had to do these tests and you had a little time to work with it. When your friends find out that you have an incurable cancer called multiple myeloma, they didn't have a lot of that. That 5 seconds I just said that they diagnosed with multiple myeloma, an incurable blood cancer that comes out of the the if. Where did that come from? You know, and and that, you know, then people don't know what to say. So, you know, they're your friends for a reason. Right? You invited them into your life for some reason. They're still those same people. They're not the same. You a friend is a friend forever. They can't do things that eliminate that. But I really encourage patients be careful with as you find out who your friends are. Really, because maybe they should have the emotional intelligence that maybe they don't understand, maybe help them in a way and give them a bit of a break. And, you know, knowing that, you know, communications to a street. Right. And there's a lot of things that I'm going to be talking about and saying that people will understand, just like when other people are talking and gesturing that maybe I don't understand. Right. So let's give each other a break. Let's work together. You're a friend of mine for a reason, Rich. Let's we won't have 30 seconds of uncomfortable conversation to work a way through, but we'll get there and it will go forward further. We'll be on a new dimension. 

Rich Bennett 28:14
Well, the other thing is to with that, you know, that friend may once you tell them. 

You know, they may be going through depression or anxiety or whatever, and it just drives their depression up even higher. And they're like, oh my God, what do I. And they're afraid of losing you. They don't want to experience that. It. People are different. 

Ray Hartjen 28:39
That's a fantastic example, Rich. You don't know what's going on with them. Maybe you maybe you haven't been there for them. You're worried about you and and but, you know, Rich isn't doing this. He said to that, Well, what am I not doing for Rich? What do I not know? I love it. Every once in a while, probably like once in a month on like an Instagram feed or Facebook feed, I get this thing that reminds me that it's like, Hey, you don't know what the other person's going through. Give them a break. 

Rich Bennett 29:06
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 29:06
Be be kind. Right. You know, they might have lost their father that day and you think he's an asshole. We'll give him a break because you don't know. So there's a great example is said, you know, you're focused on like, hey, I've got cancer, but what's what's my friend got and what are they dealing with? And, you know. 

Rich Bennett 29:22
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 29:23
Great example. 

Rich Bennett 29:25
They may even have it and just never told you. 

Ray Hartjen 29:27
That's right. 

That happens a lot. There's people in my support groups that like there's one guy I know who has pancreatic cancer. The only person that knows is his mom because he lives he lives with his mother and she had to have some surgeries and and. But yeah, that's the way he wants to do it. There's another guy I know that some people know, but his mother doesn't know because he doesn't want to burden his mom with this with this health problems because, you know, she's just older. That's, you know, let her live her life without this burden. So it's you know, it's deeply personal aspect for me. It's an open book. You know, I, I literally wrote a book because I want it to be a resource. You know, I for for your listeners, it's very important for me to tell you this. The the proceeds, the net writer's proceeds for the book me, myself on multiple myeloma are pledged to benefit the multiple myeloma research. And so, you know, I said earlier that, you know, once I was diagnosed, you know, because of my you know, what I've done, you know, like musically and through writing and like, you know, I have some degree of of like some online following. And so when I first got diagnosed, you know, people reached out to me, you know, and I was in on these interviews because of these interviews, had more people reach out to me asking me questions. Patients and caregivers, you know, And I thought, well, you know, I love doing that. It's become like a passion of mine, a calling. How can I help? I'm going to be a service. And but it was a 1 to 1 aspect and took a lot of time. So I was thinking, what can I do for one too many? And I'm like, Oh, I could write a book, you know, So how can I answer? Maybe some of these questions and scale, right? But I didn't want to do it for me. Hey, look at me. There's my story. There's a there's too much narcissism with that. So I thought, you know, how can I create a resource for patients and caregivers and allies that you know, from the community, for the community that benefits the community that, oh, let's partner MRF, let's raise some funds, advanced treatments, maybe eventually get to a cure. You know, again, it goes back to the principle number four. We're all in this together. You know, how can I? So it was really important for me to do that. And I did use the word narcissism in that, you know, in that last little description for any of you who go to the go to a site after listening this term, you'll see my my pictures on the cover. In fact, there's three pictures of me on the cover. And that was a that was a that caused a lot of anxiety. I mean, I mean, is it is that kind of like a dick move to put yourself on the cover? You know, and but but so I asked my online community, my community says, put it on, put yourself on it. It can be a personal story. And we want to know about your personal story. We don't only know about some anonymous story. We don't want to know about a collection of anonymous stories. We want to hear your story. And so reluctantly, I put myself on the cover. So it was not a narcissism. It was a great deal of introspection. It caused a lot of anxiety, but that's what the people want it now. It's live in America. It's what the people want rid. 

Rich Bennett 32:29
Yeah, they just. They want to see. They want to put the face to the story. Makes sense, you know? And then when they go to the Web site and they see the pictures of you from your younger days with the long hair and everything, then they can recognize you now. 

Ray Hartjen 32:49
It's really good as a guitar player and your son might know this, you know, you get paid more when your hair's longer. 

Rich Bennett 32:55
Oh, 

Ray Hartjen 32:55
Before 

Rich Bennett 32:56
I know. 

Ray Hartjen 32:56
you get more, you get more credibility as a guitar player when your hair is longer. So sometimes you've got to do what you've got to do. But putting food on the table, man. 

Rich Bennett 33:05
Just go through it in front of you and let it get stuck in your string. That's how I never understood how Stevie Ray Vaughan played guitar with all that damn stuff hanging down. 

But I mean, he you know, he was just a. 

Ray Hartjen 33:19
I love interviews. And you know, you've mentioned Stevie Ray Vaughan before, you know, like your sons, the reincarnation SRB. I love introducing young people to Stevie Ray Vaughan. You know, it's like, you know, this is this is your homework, You know, here's a CD. 

Rich Bennett 33:34
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 33:35
Live. Right? Here's a CB, Listen to it, understand it. And and yeah it's it's really cool to do and that's you 

Rich Bennett 33:45
You're. 

Ray Hartjen 33:45
know. Our old number one. I don't know if you know the story about old number one, which is got to be I love pictures, that guitar. That is a road war gig. But that guitar was originally owned by Christopher Cross. 

Rich Bennett 34:00
No, I did not know that. 

Ray Hartjen 34:02
Stealing. Take me away. That was his guitar. But even he got rid of it. He sold it. And I sold it to a guitar shop in Austin, Texas, where I learned that Stevie Ray had picked it up. So just not that long ago. Earlier this year, he posed for a cross posed next to that guitar. But you think about the different types of music played on guitar, right from Christopher Cross and do due to Stevie Ray Vaughan. 

Rich Bennett 34:27
I never knew that. Well, that's my music. My my first music lesson for today. I mean, you're always learning 

Ray Hartjen 34:37
That's right. 

Rich Bennett 34:38
new 

Ray Hartjen 34:38
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 34:38
stuff. It goes. So I got to tell you this story. So when my son was probably about five or six, this back when I was working for corporate America, we were going he and I were driving to a picnic, a company picnic, and I had a radio on. Well, Zeppelin came on. I'm jamming, as is my song. You know who this is, Bubba? These. Let's. Led Zeppelin. I'll see ya. I was proud. That proud Dad. Me because he recognized the babies. Yeah, They suck. What a hard job we had to. 

Ray Hartjen 35:19
All that in a couple of seconds right there. Oh, there's a side to this immense confusion. 

Rich Bennett 35:23
Oh, my God. But. But, Daddy. As he got older, he learned to appreciate music more. He. He became a professional deejay with me when he was only 13. Started playing. Because when when I got him his first guitar, I told him, I said, Look, I'll get you a guitar, but I'm not going to sign you up for lessons. I want you to learn yourself how to play. Once you get good enough, if you want to take lessons, that's fine, because you know how 

when you start them off young, you go sign them up for lessons. What's the first song they learn how to play? Usually Smoke on the Water or House of the Rising Sun. And, you know, they their learn is somebody else's style. So I wanted him to learn himself. Then I guess he was 15 or 16, and his mother signed him up for lessons and she asked me if I could take him to his first lesson. And I did. And took him and met his instructor. And his instructor said, Well, sit down. Let me see what you could do. And my son played it, which blew me away. And the starter looked at music. Rich. Well, she won't be through with him. So that is it. He's like, No, he's good. I said, Good. I said, I would love. And I said, If I'm wrong, let me know. I said, But I would love for him to learn Spanish guitar and classical guitar because I think a guitar player, if they knew those styles, they're going they're going to be the best. I mean, you look at Stevie Ray, you look at Carlos Santana, Jimi Hendrix, they could play that stuff. One of the thing, first thing she learned how to play when he started lessons was Thelonious Monk. He? Oh, yeah, he just now he doesn't play as much as he used to, but I wish he would, but became a hell of a deejay to. 

Ray Hartjen 37:18
You know, I've been associated with the music school in in the East Bay of Northern California. Friend of mine's instructor. In fact, I periodically take lessons from a shred master, he says. Well renowned death metal guitar player. 

Rich Bennett 37:35
Oh, wow. 

Ray Hartjen 37:36
Lot different than what I play. But he's a he's a he's a master truly at guitar. And but I like talking to younger kids. You know, a lot of times you get into lessons for a while. You begin to hate your instrument right? You know, you've had these, you know, draconian teachers that have any place scales. You know, pentatonic scales on the guitar are important. If you want to be a lead guitar player and soloist, but like a kid picks up a guitar to begin with. Yeah, you might want to get to that. But what they want to do is play songs, right? You know? And so forget about, you know, doing these scales and these individual notes, learn chords and be able to play. And then you get some motivations like, Wow, I just played. I know how to play like this really cool Green Day song. This is like one of my favorites. And 

Rich Bennett 38:15
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 38:15
that it's easy to keep playing guitar. And then if you play guitar 20 minutes a day over the course of a couple of years, you're pretty good actually. You know, you don't need to do, you know, a couple of hours a day and it but it's certainly no good to do an hour once a week that that doesn't do any instrument any good. But I, I really enjoy seeing kids pick up songs and this the songs that they want to play. So I love it when an instructor says, Great, what's what's your favorite song? Let's learn how to play it right now. How's that motivated? Motivate you to continue your instrument? So yeah, and then you're right, You know that you diversify your styles on any type of instrument, really, and you become much better. You can you can play anything, but then you can bring those types of influences into the the type of music that you prefer. 

Rich Bennett 38:56
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 38:57
Some of the some of that, you know, fingerpicking style with, you know, Spanish and classical guitar fits in fabulously with soloing and lead guitar. And then like playing, you know, crunchy rock and roll music wrote some. 

Rich Bennett 39:10
Actually with because you're still playing. Now you have you. It's. You're not well, you're not in a band. It's a duo right now, right. 

Ray Hartjen 39:19
It's a band called The Chronic Padres. You know, we keep repeating this. 60 years old, 60 year old guitar player, man, it's it's it's no longer as enjoyable as it used to be with the prospect of let's start at 9:00 at night and end at one 

Rich Bennett 39:37
You 

Ray Hartjen 39:37
a. 

Rich Bennett 39:37
help me a bit by nine. 

Ray Hartjen 39:38
Yeah. You know, so, you know, about ten years ago, I went to Scott Singer and I said, Hey, Scott, imagine this, you know, two dudes, acoustic guitars, taken all their favorite songs, stripping it down to their acoustic essentials, sort of like the MTV Unplugged episode from the early nineties. That was everybody's favorites, right? Nirvana Unplugged, Alice in Chains. And then we do Happy Hour or, you know, or 5 to 8, you know, we're home by, you know, 839 clock where ordinarily we'd just be plugging in and starting. And I was like, yeah, So, you know, we're blessed to be in an area with a lot of wineries, a lot of breweries. You know, we built ourselves as Northern California's happy our house band. And so we kind of specialize in, you know, you know, patio music, you know, you know, hanging out. And then, you know, we started with the rock and roll classics stripped down to the essentials. We've integrated our original music and integrated country music for a simple reason that ladies like country music and rich, don't fool yourself. Every dude picked up a guitar for the first time to impress the ladies. So it's it's never, never far from our mind. It's like, let's give the ladies what they want. And if they want some country music, we'll give them a country music. 

Rich Bennett 40:52
Yeah, I went from drums to guitar because I just, you know, the guitar player was always out front. 

And that figure, Daria, which I'm I'm going to try singing. Then I got kicked out. 

Ray Hartjen 41:04
I do like a feature drums more often. There's a band called Mute Meth. First time I saw them, you know, the drummer's like, front and center, right? You know, he's got their. He comes out with his headphones on, protect his youth, and he gets duct tape and just kicks it all around like he's a rugby players of the duct tape in his ears down and then he goes to town. But he was like part of the he wasn't hidden in the back, you know, he's 

Rich Bennett 41:27
But. 

Ray Hartjen 41:27
a. I always like it when they do that. It's like they're important with other drummer. I like to make fun. As a guitar player, I like to make fun of it, right? It's just so easy to do. Like, how do you get the drummer off your front porch? You pay for the pizza, you know. What do you call a drummer who just broke up with his girlfriend? Who's homeless, you know, and all that other stuff. But. But you know what? They're the heartbeat of the band, right? 

Rich Bennett 41:51
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 41:52
We all have a percussion section in our chest and with, you know, in a band when when you have a bad drummer, when you have a bad drummer, it's sort of like a bit like being a referee in any type of sporting contest. If you as a spectator notice the referee is doing a bad job, you know. But if you notice the drummer in the band, a lot of times it's because he's doing a bad job or it is a thankless job and. 

Rich Bennett 42:19
Or he's out front. 

So actually with with your with you playing music and your love of listening to music. Has that been like therapy for you as well? Now, especially after you were diagnosed? 

Ray Hartjen 42:34
That's a great question. I never really thought about it as therapy, but I think you're right. No one knew. When I play particular, when I play and when I perform, I'm the last thing I'm thinking about this. This cancer is a it is it is a break. So, yeah, you know, I you know, I love I love just plain, you know, and we have a little goldendoodle. His name is Quinn. Quinn likes it when I play. Whatever. 

Rich Bennett 43:06
Yes. 

Ray Hartjen 43:08
Huh? 

Rich Bennett 43:09
Quinn, the Eskimo. 

Ray Hartjen 43:11
Quinn The Golden Doodle. 

Rich Bennett 43:13
Yeah, I had to throw a song reference in. 

Ray Hartjen 43:17
But but, Quinn, no matter what he's doing or stop doing his doing or come over and lay down. He's a young girl. Was listened to. But, you know, he's a great stage dog. You know, I've taken him to some some solo gigs at a brewery and, you know, he just chills out at my feet on a stool, you know, sitting on a stool doing my thing. And he just chills up and down below me. So that, yeah, find a, you know, peace and tranquility with music. Even with I mean, I guess when I'm not like, listen to Metallica, it's not peace and tranquility, but it is an escapism, right? You know, And then I appreciate good hard music. I mean, that that's some of my favorites. In fact, my my favorite is Van Halen. And I grew up I you know, in that era, it's like, what? What did I just hear? First time I heard a eruption and that whole first album, I'm like, what is that and how can I do it? This is what I want to do. 

Rich Bennett 44:09
All right. I, I got to ask, though. Van Halen, ever heard of Van Hagar era? 

Ray Hartjen 44:17
Both. I'm not going to kick either one of them out. I. 

Rich Bennett 44:20
Because that he was still involved. So. 

Ray Hartjen 44:22
Yeah. Like, lately, for the last month or so, I have been just transfixed on the song. 5150. I mean, what a great. It's a van Hagar song, but what a great opening riff that gets, you know, repeat that to the thing. But, you know, I would have said, you know, a few years ago, like all over the David Lee Roth era of Van Halen, I like them both. But then, yeah, you know, sometimes David gets off the rails a little bit with this. He can be he can be out there. In fact, he's rarely here. He's mostly out over there. And so, yeah, it's but I like them both. I'm not going to I'm not going to not listen to one of them. So. 

Rich Bennett 45:06
Well. 

Ray Hartjen 45:07
But you got to that question, really, do you? Hey, Gareth. 

Rich Bennett 45:12
In all honesty, I do like them both because I the first time I heard Van Halen was the first album. And I just. I fell in love with them right away. And then when you see them perform, David Lee's a hell of a frontman. When he is there. I mean, but I was always a Hagar fan ever since Montrose. I was kind of shocked when 

Hagar joined Van Halen. I don't think anybody was expecting. 

You know, it's kind of like, Oh, God, how is this going to sound? But I was blown away. 

Ray Hartjen 45:53
Yeah. We got lucky, didn't we? When, you know, when Roth left, then he was like, Oh, no, that's a great. 

Rich Bennett 45:59
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 46:00
And now it's now it's gone away. Then all of a sudden. Yeah, I think it is. Wait a second, Sammy Hagar, What's that going to be like? Oh, that's pretty damn good. We saved it and we. We learned a lesson with Van Halen three and Gary Cherone. Right. You know, it's actually kind of like some of that music of that album, but it was like, you know, how you know, how disaster could have been for the the whole genre, really, if if they hadn't gone with Sammy Hagar, if they'd just gone straight to someone like. 

Rich Bennett 46:26
Exactly. Well, you know, and the thing is with. Yeah, I mean, I mean, you and I are the same age. We've seen rock change throughout the years. And there's some bands from back in the seventies I cannot stand that I love today. And there's albums like one of my favorite bands was always Kiss. I always loved Kiss because when it came to concerts. Sorry. There is nobody better that could put on a concert. But one of my favorite albums by them. A lot of people and a lot of his fans say it was their worst album and that was music from the Elder. And I think I think the reason it's one of my favorites is because it was different. 

Ray Hartjen 47:13
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 47:14
And what was the 

Metallica album that came out? Everybody talked about how bad it was, and it's actually a very good album if you listen to it sometimes. Have to change, you know. 

Ray Hartjen 47:30
Yeah. And, you know, Metallica, you know, went through that when they cut their hair and things like that. 

Rich Bennett 47:34
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 47:35
Selling out. I mean, it's like, you know, you have to change and evolve as a musician if you're not if you're not, you know, evolving, you're just kind of like withering away. And how many times have you stopped kind of like being enthused about a band because they haven't changed. So you got to. 

Rich Bennett 47:49
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 47:50
Sounds like the other one. 

Rich Bennett 47:51
Hey. 

Ray Hartjen 47:52
It's like, what's going to make you happy is you want the same old, same old, or you want a, you know, evolution to do stuff. And sometimes you don't agree with it. And I can remember in Benny Hill was introducing keyboards in the 1984 albums like Wait A. 

Rich Bennett 48:03
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 48:04
It did pretty well, right? You know? So, you know, that's okay. And, you know, you see Guns and Roses with the keyboard up on stage, you know, what are you doing? You know, but. 

Rich Bennett 48:14
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 48:15
If you if you think for a second there were actually violins on November rain, you're wrong. That was awesome. 

Rich Bennett 48:23
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 48:24
So those are keyboards. So yeah, you know, it's, you know, Guns and Roses has. Evolved. 

Rich Bennett 48:31
Well, hell, Ray, you think about it. Yeah, because you Metallica cut their hair. But if you look at a lot of these hair bands from the eighties that are still performing. All right. Those of you listen to I hate to disappoint you all, but a lot of times that's not their real hair. They're wearing wigs. They'll. 

Ray Hartjen 48:49
Good. Good to hear. I. I. I. I love eighties. 

Rich Bennett 48:54
Oh, me too. 

Ray Hartjen 48:56
We're you know, this was a things that, you know, the soundtracks of my life. But, you know, it's you know, you got to catch these bands while you can. You know, it's very difficult for a musician to make money off of recorded music. You know, you can. 

Rich Bennett 49:07
Oh, yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 49:08
Thousand streams on Spotify and you know, you'll get paid less than $5,000. That doesn't 

Rich Bennett 49:14
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 49:14
cover insurance, right? So, you know, these acts have to tour. And if you, you know, Rich, you know, somebody of our generation, I just read a book that the name of the author escapes me in the full title. The book escapes me, but it's old records never die. And it's about a guy in the Chicagoland area who, like a lot of us, that got rid of his vinyl albums. But then he was on a quest to get them back, and he didn't want this like, you know, a copy. He wanted his exact records back like a Bon Jovi Slippery with Wet album that had his girlfriend's phone number written on it. You know, he wanted it. So, you know, it's a book about this kind of fanatical search, you know, where's that replacement album that smells like the marijuana, you know, excess where you used to stash marijuana. And it's a it's a cool book. And just you know, it brings back this idea of, you know, recorded music for people our age. It was kind of like this community thing, like, you know, I come to your house, borrow your kids, destroy your album so you can borrow my, you know, a Frampton Comes Alive album or whatever. And, you know, they're kind of like almost neighbourhood properties in a way. And you'd be listening to them and their DC stories and you know, you can take the music with it yet put it on the turntable and, you know, read the liner notes and all that stuff. And it's a cool book. So if you like reading about music and if you also like enjoy the nostalgia of a good LP, it's great. But old records never die. There's a subtitle along it, but I found it. 

Rich Bennett 50:42
I'm going to find that now. I love reading books like that. You know, anything of music I can sit down and read? Those are the ones I don't want to listen to in audible form. Actually. Speaking of which, with your book, Me, myself and my multiple myeloma, is that in audio form as well? 

Ray Hartjen 50:58
Not an ideal. Both those books and me myself, my multiple myeloma are from Morgan James Publishing, and at Morgan James, we don't we don't look at an audible format until a few months have gone by just to see if it's in. 

Rich Bennett 51:12
Not a bad idea, though. 

Ray Hartjen 51:14
Time and effort. Yeah. You know, people tell me I have a face for radio, so maybe. 

Rich Bennett 51:18
Yeah, I've heard that about me. 

Ray Hartjen 51:20
So. So maybe. A Yeah, I'd be happy to sit down and read it. So 

Rich Bennett 51:25
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 51:26
I know like my wife, for example, she doesn't read any more. She's strictly all the books. And I've never tried one out, but one I'd like to try out is Matthew McConaughey's Greenlights, because I like Matthew McConaughey. He's got a great voice, I think, for an audio book. 

Rich Bennett 51:39
Right. 

Ray Hartjen 51:40
All right, All right, All right. 

Rich Bennett 51:43
Yeah, I just. I just had somebody on. Somebody else saw who went through Morgan James Publishing. They said the same thing. And to me, that makes sense. Wait for a while before you release an audio book of it. Because that way it's still keeping it. Like the like it's new alive still. You know, if that makes. 

Ray Hartjen 52:04
It is frustrating when someone says, Do you have an audio book and you can't deliver it. When you have a customer ask for something. It's like, again, I don't have it quite yet. But if you want to, I can we can just have like a phone call and I can read it to you yourself. 

Rich Bennett 52:18
Actually with your book, because I know you're doing the podcast circuit, which is important. I always tell authors, I don't care if it's a children's book or whatever, get on podcast and promote it. What else are you doing as far as marketing for your book? 

Ray Hartjen 52:33
I know a lot of it is through social media. I am also, you know, in selling books or publicizing promoting books. I like to use what we use in music way back before the Internet and then as a street team. You know, the street team is the dudes going out in the parking lot, you know, putting flyers. 

Rich Bennett 52:50
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 52:51
The windshield I live in, in Seattle. At the time there was a telephone pole around. It didn't have you know, it wasn't like swelled with posters, you know, had been stapled up. We know we don't do that these days. But, you know, you know, recruiting a street team of, you know, evangelists to be able to read the book, post reviews about the book and spread that out. So, you know, like, you know, with books, it's there's a there's a lot of long tail activities because the best promotion book is word of mouth. You know, what I do is what I just did to all your listeners for Old Records Never die, you know? And so, you know, you have listeners out there, you know, next thing you know, this author's going to have a spike in the purchases of books because some knucklehead named Ray was on the show and talked about it. Right? So, you know, you want to deliver a good product and do that. And so, you know, I do, you know, Tick Tock and Facebook and Instagram, I'm a relatively new tech talker being a six year old guy. Somebody told me said. 

Rich Bennett 53:45
Try to get the hang of it. 

Ray Hartjen 53:47
He said, This guy told me a story, gets you got messages to tell. And so people that need to hear it and those people are ticked off. And I'm like, 

Rich Bennett 53:55
The. 

Ray Hartjen 53:55
okay, let's give it a try. So so Drew out there, look for me very hard and I'll take off and I'll look for you, Rich. 

Rich Bennett 54:04
Do it while doing it. Tik Tok is still here before. Bill Gates sighed, and his band. 

Ray Hartjen 54:11
So a lot of a lot of social media and then, you know. 

Rich Bennett 54:13
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 54:14
Love with the Immaculate Book. You know, we've had the pleasure of like speaking at libraries and book signings and bookstores, and it's always really cool to, you know, get the people, you know, want to know about your book. You know, it's a very rewarding. A friend of mine, ex boss of mine, has read me myself on multiple myeloma and he calls me up and said, you know, I've read the chapter about taking things for granted three times. And I didn't read it because I was confused because I didn't understand it, but I reread it because it was it. I picked up new things and it made an impact. And I was like, That's one of the most rewarding things I think I've ever heard. Wow, you like you care enough to read it for the first time. It's humbling and I'm very grateful. But then you read it three times. That's why I hope you read it Fourth. I mean, that's super rewarding to hear. And and so when I really get some word of mouth and people talking about things that that works best to promote. 

Rich Bennett 55:11
So like a record album? Yeah. You can listen to a record over and over again. So those of you listening, you can read Ray's book over and over. 

Ray Hartjen 55:19
Tell all your friends that you just have to read it over and over again. 

Rich Bennett 55:23
Actually tell everybody why they should buy your book. Besides, of course, you're making them, you know, so they can support you and help you make money. But tell me why they really need to buy this. 

Ray Hartjen 55:38
Yeah. You know, the the book's not just about multiple myeloma. I think it applies to everything. It's how multiple myeloma changed me. And it's, you know, it does give a bit of insight like to my stem cell transplant and the chemotherapy and things like that. So but you know, I think it's I think there's some messages in there, like the messages about the chapter's called Who's Buried and Taken for granted, too, you know, And that's when we explore the idea of taking things for granted. You know what we cover? I cover things in the book, like this timeline exercise that, you know, it's very simple. It's like all of you listening right now can do it mentally in your head. Imagine a piece of paper in front of you, blank. You take a marker and you draw a horizontal line from left to right and the left hand side make a little tick mark, right hand side, make it tick. Mark That's your timeline. Left hand side represents your birth, right hand side represents your death. So now take a moment and think, where are you on that timeline? Where do you think where do you believe you 

Rich Bennett 56:33
Oh, damn. 

Ray Hartjen 56:35
And then you're like, Well, geez, I always kind of thought I was in the middle. But, you know, I'm 60 years old. I've got an incurable blood cancer. I'm a little bit further to the right than I thought I was yesterday. Right. You know. And so, you know, what does that do to you introspectively? You know, how using this and understand, you know, that thinking about it, what are you going to do different today, knowing that? What do you think your time is now? I know it's kind of in a way, it's ridiculous. We none of us are promised tomorrow. But you do have a feeling the thing you know, if you're in, it's the best that we can do in this uncertain world we live in. But, you know, the book talks about things like that, and then I know I want it to be a resource for patients, but I also want to be a resource for caregivers. Caregivers have it. A lot of patients thinks it's tougher than caregivers. And the example I'll give you is anybody who's been a partner with somebody who's gone through childbirth, you know, it's like, Oh my God, this is a person I care for, I love. And they are uncomfortable, you know, but I don't know how much they can. It's very, I think, a lot of anxiety. But, you know, the woman given, you know, delivery, she has no idea of where she is, you know, and what she can take me. I mean, I was watching my wife deliver twice. I didn't know that she could take reverse the roles. Now I'm getting a stem cell transplant, heavy chemotherapy doses, nausea and the whole thing. I know what I can do and what I got left first. But she doesn't. Right. And it's, you know, and then all the help that she has provided, caregivers are tough. I want to be a resource for them. I want to be resourceful allies. But I also didn't want to make it just about just by cancer, too. For me, I think the lessons in the book 

are thought provoking. I don't to even call them lessons. The ideas in the book, you know, are there to help the reader just think about it for themselves and hopefully they can make some changes in their lives. If it's just those four things I talked to you about earlier, Rich goes here, you know, mitigate your risk factors. You know, reach out to those in need and to, you know, find your passion. If it's just that that they pick up, you know, I think that's, you know, worth it. And you know, again, it's not it's not the money is going to the Multiple Myeloma Research Foundation. It's you know, when I've been in need. I know. 

Rich Bennett 58:40
All of the money. 

Ray Hartjen 58:42
All of my money. 

Rich Bennett 58:44
Wow. Okay. 

Ray Hartjen 58:45
Buy it at Amazon or whatever. Amazon is going to take some money and I don't know what they're going to do with it, but they're probably going to keep it. You know, but all of my money goes to multiple Myeloma Research Foundation because, you know, there's been times when I needed I've needed to be pulled forward. I've had people in my support group or what have you, you know, reach back at people for I'm feeling good. I feel healthy, I feel strong. And I had the desire to help others. I want to reach back now. Who needs a helping hand? Let's pull up on. 

Rich Bennett 59:10
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 59:11
And there's this, you know, analogy that, you know, some people use. It's like, you know, like going into a fight with people behind me. I find tremendous power going into my fight with people not behind me, but alongside me. Right. You know, there's a little bit of a difference there. And, you know, we're locked, you know, elbow to elbow in lockstep with one another going Fortinet energizes me and then hopefully I can help energize people who need it, whether you're a patient, a caregiver, ally, whatever, you know, I want to be of service. I learned a lesson from a guy, an author in the San Diego area. His name is. BOBKOFF Geo. F.F. He has a book called Love Does, and he has a lot of other books. And but, you know, in The Love does book, he has his phone number, his mobile phone number. And and I'm like, wow. And that's how much of service he wants to be to his community. It's like, call me. I've called him. He picked up, you know, and I so I took a lesson that my email address and phone number in the book reach out to me. Anything that I can do for you, Rich, and your listeners, I'm sincere. Reach out to me. You can hit me at all my social properties. It's my name Ray Hartshorne h a r t g in my email address is that at gmail.com and reach out to me and. And how can I be of service? The answer is yes. You just have to ask me the question, right? 

Rich Bennett 1:00:30
Mm hmm. I love that. So those of you listening. Okay. Go to Ray Hart's CNN.com by his book. After you read it, still leave it for review on Amazon and Goodreads, because that's going to just help drive the algorithm up so more people will purchase the book. But it's important that you buy it the first time from his website. And then, you know, again, leave the reviews. Right before I get to my last question, is there anything you would like to add? 

Ray Hartjen 1:01:05
First of all, my my gratitude for you and your audience for having me along. You know, I've enjoyed our conversation and I love what you're doing over with conversations. So, you know, keep on doing what you do. I'm looking forward to seeing the the the beard begins, you know, here in a month and a week or so. So looking forward to spreading and spreading goodwill in the holiday season. You know, there's a part of the book that that is that's related to the beard has begun. When I was a kid, Bjorn Borg was the tennis player. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:39
Oh, wow. Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 1:01:41
No end. And I read this article in Sports Illustrated that resonated with me. It was entitled The Beard Has Begun. And what he did was, you know, Borg's, you know. Fanatical, maniacal focus on Wimbledon. You wouldn't shave. You know, leading up to it, you know, because he was too occupied. And doing stuff is more important. I need to get ready for Wimbledon. I don't need to be shaved. So, you know, every time he looked in the mirror, every time he touched his face, it was he was reminded I got Wimbledon moments right in front of me. The beard has begun. And that made it. I've remembered that title. I do that all the time when I'm leading up to like alternate game days, fight nights, things like that. But in my book, there's a, you know, chapters about the beard has begun. I knew I was going to chemotherapy that was going to make me bald, lose all my hair. So I was like, you know what? I'm going to do it my way. I'm going to not cut my hair. The beard has begun. I'm not going to shave now. I'm going to cut my hair. You know this as I prepare myself physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, to to undergo my stem cell transplant. And then we're going to shave it off as a fundraiser for the Multiple Myeloma Research Foundation. So held a pardon, you know, with a long hair guitar player. I mean, I've had so many friends and my wife, it's like, just cut your hair, you know, And it's like, well, you go, okay, this is your chance for 20 bucks. You get a swipe of the razor, right? You know, and at this party we had, you know, it's like $270 later, I was I was bald. But and we did for a good cause. The beard has begun. I'm looking forward to answer your question. Thank you so much for allowing me to be here. And I'm looking forward to all the stuff that you do, both with this podcast and with When your Beard begins, begins on June 1st. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:20
Oh, well, thank you, man. It was a pleasure. The door is open any time you want to come back. I could sit here and talk to you for an hour just about music alone. 

Ray Hartjen 1:03:31
Let's do it. Compile our top ten lists each then and then have a friendly, not a debate, but like a Let me try to convince you the the the majesty of Soundgarden. Super unknown, you know, if you're familiar with it or something, you know. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:46
See. But that would be hard because I think you and I, you and I like the same stuff. 

Ray Hartjen 1:03:52
But you're going to come. You're going to come up with this kiss thing or, you know, I would've said Kiss Destroyer. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:57
Well. 

Ray Hartjen 1:03:57
And you're like, you, you know, so. But. But yeah, I always like the top ten list of people. You know, you sit back with the little glass of bourbon and it's like, well, it's like top ten Influential, influential. You know, you got to have Hendrix in there because Hendrix, you can hear a lot of music today. It's not Hendrix music, but you can hear it in that music. Great. So you got to put him in an influential album, right? You know, And it's it's always fun, I think, you know, which Led Zeppelin album you got to have one so you want right, You know. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:26
Ooh, that would be good. Yeah, I'll of all pick an artist, but you can only keep one album of their. 

Ray Hartjen 1:04:34
You're on a desert. You're going to be on a deserted island. You could. You could bring a phonograph. You could bring one record of all your favorites, but only one record. If you got if you like Van Halen one end any old do you got to make a joint? 

Rich Bennett 1:04:47
Decide. One or two. Ooh, man, that would be hard. You know what, Ray? We're going to do that. You and I are going to do an episode on that. If you're up for it, I'm all for brother. 

Ray Hartjen 1:04:58
Let's call it this or that, and you get to. Presented, right? You know, it's like this or that. Which where are you going to take? 

Rich Bennett 1:05:05
Yeah, we'll just have. And we'll be sipping our bourbon while we're doing it. 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:10
It will start off with a this or that with bourbon. You're going to like Maker's Mark or Basil Hayden or something like that. And we'll have to 

Rich Bennett 1:05:16
Ooh. 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:16
have. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:18
Haven't had to be late yet. I have to try to. 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:20
Yeah, it's it's kind of becoming more and more popular, but. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:24
Yeah, yeah, I've heard. I've heard a lot of good reviews about how to give that. 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:29
Blanton Yeah. You know, I 

Rich Bennett 1:05:31
Over 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:31
the. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:33
here. Of course, if we get Pappy Van Winkle 23 year reserve. If anybody wants to donate that to us, we'll be more than happy. 

Ray Hartjen 1:05:42
If you have a weekend, a three way conversation, you bring the pappy. And Richard, I will talk to you. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:50
There you go. All right. So out of all the podcasts that you've been on so far, is there anything a host has never asked you that you wish they would have asked you? And if so, what would be that question? What would be your answer? 

Ray Hartjen 1:06:08
What a great question. Well, what would I hope people asked me? You know, 

I don't know. You know, I. 

think maybe. I think. I think. 

And I know even how to phrase the question, Rich, But, you know, when we talked about I love you and the vulnerability and things like that, you know, and like what what changed that for me? You know, it's like, you know, what was the impetus to change it? And it wasn't my cancer diagnosis. It was this like in my late twenties or early twenties or early thirties when I, for the very first time heard the word emotional intelligence and the IQ. And and I didn't know what that was, you know. You know, just for those of you who are not familiar with the X of IQ, IQ, your intellect, you think that the IQ is your emotional and you're feeling like empathy and things like that. And and I was always kind of very guarded with my emotions, I think is part of the way I kind of grew up. You know, it's like the vulnerability let you know how I feel. It was kind of viewed as a weakness, you know, and and know I meet my wife and, you know, my wife is an empath. She's very empathetic and she views herself as that. That's her superpower is her ability to be sensitive. Like before I met her, I would have viewed being sensitive as a weakness, you know, like, you know, you you know, but for her, it's her superpower. And just being open, open to that. And, you know, I'm still learning and still trying to, you know, come to grips with it. But I know that I can have more more intimate relationships, more meaningful relationships, more intimate, meaningful conversations. I'm willing to be a little bit vulnerable and to share like how things make me feel and to ask. And maybe if I don't do that enough, even when I think about it now, it's like, you know, asking other people like how they feel without, you know, the, you know, the best. Like, you know, how's it going feel different when you're not really asking. You're really saying hi. But yeah, you know, it's something that's a continuing learning lesson for me. But I think next to it, When when did you make that pivot? I'm still trying to make that pivot, but it is something that it took me, you know, 28, 29 years on the planet to even. 

So I think that's the question that you just ask before. 

Rich Bennett 1:08:32
It's in Everybody's Different with me. It was when I when I was in the Marine Corps 

and I lost my cousin, who was a hell of a musician. And he was one of the reasons I got into music and he was killed. And I was I think I was in basic training at the time and I couldn't come home. And I felt so bad because I did. I loved the man he is because of him. I learned so much. And that's when it hit me. So you know what you tell people everyday, because maybe the only time you see them, it may be the last time you see him is that you punch yourself in the face Today. The. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:18
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:19
And God, I wish and I wish you when it came of that motto a long time ago. Ray, Come on now. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:26
Thank you for your service in the Marine Corps. I didn't know. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:28
All. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:29
So thank you. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:30
Oh, my God. I mean, I. I loved it. I would do it all over again if I wasn't sure about. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:36
Big whoop. You might be a little tougher now, is that what you're saying? 

Rich Bennett 1:09:43
Yeah. That note. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:47
Remember when Riddick was it Riddick Bowe, you know, former heavyweight champion, the world. He wanted to be a marine and he figured. 

Rich Bennett 1:09:53
Yeah. 

Ray Hartjen 1:09:54
Heavyweight champ of the world may not want to fight camps like new boot camp. Not everybody. Yeah. So. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:01
I don't know how it is today. I know when I went through. Yeah, it was. It was tough. I got punched one time and I learned my lesson real quick because I had my it was during inspection. I had my back to the drill instructor as he came. Came down the line at Bam. I mean, he clocked me dead square in the middle of the back. Oh, sure, bitch. I turned right around. Step to attention. So. 

Ray Hartjen 1:10:31
But next to that next inspection, you were probably got attention. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:35
Oh. 

Ray Hartjen 1:10:36
Early. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:36
Yeah, I was. And I you know, you learn when you go, you just keep your mouth shut. You do what they tell you to do. You'll be in. Supposedly. He'll be fine, Howard. My father always say they brainwash me. Well, no shit. Yeah, that's what they do, is they brainwash. 

Ray Hartjen 1:10:57
I. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:57
Ray. Oh, go ahead. 

Ray Hartjen 1:11:00
I was going to say, you know, they're training you. They're not brainwashing in their training. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:03
Yeah. 

Exactly. So, Ray, thanks a lot. And I'm serious. Maybe if you want to do the other one or music, I would love to do that. 

Ray Hartjen 1:11:12
Let's do it. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:13
Okay. 

Ray Hartjen 1:11:14
Have you also have your listeners vote if you do not want this sort of like members of Saturday Night Live episodes like Andy Kaufman, is he going to come back or are we going to kill Larry the Lobster or whatever? It's like if you do not want to hear Ray talking about music, you let Rich know that. But if you if you stay quiet, that's an implicit yes vote. So. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:36
Who wouldn't? I always think about with when it comes to the musicians. When I was Chris Farley, like when he interviewed Paul McCartney. So it's. 

You remember that time when you were in the Beatles? It's just it's hilarious. Anyways, Rae, thanks so much. It's been an honor and a true pleasure. I love you, brother. The door open. Let's do it again. 

Ray Hartjen 1:12:08
Thank you so much for the opportunity. Love you, too. Thank you.